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OpSic66
No, not all lubricants are the same. This is definatly true for silicone sprays.

No, not all of them are "safe" for airsoft use.

NO WD-40, liquid wrench, PB Blaster, etc... or real steel gun products! (thanks BroodRed, I forgot this one)


What do you need to know, or do about this. - Well, read below.


Silicone spray lube: Generally any should work.....
Provided - it does not contain any: petroleum distilates, petroleum by-products, Hydro-Carbons, or any harsh petroleum based products,
Such as: Hexane, Heptane, Toluene, Xylene, Ethelene, Xylol, Toluol, Naptha, benzene or any other flamable substance! (aside from the propellents listed below).

If it is using ISO-Butane, or propane "as a propellent", that is fine.




Silicone Grease: (paste, non aerosol, whatever.. - This also goes double for ANY other type of grease.)
Again, you want a grease without the same chemicals listed.
Does not contain any: petroleum distilates, petroleum by-products, Hydro-Carbons, or any harsh petroleum based products,
Such as: Hexane, Heptane, Toluene, Xylene, Ethelene, Xylol, Toluol, Naptha, benzene or any other flamable substance!



Recomended Lubes and Greases:

Permatex dielectric grease. From autozone it's 100% silicone, and 5.99 a tube. Great for cylinder/airseal components. (Thanks GoLgo 13)
Permatex white lithium grease. Again from autozone in a tube for $2.99, works great for gears.
STTi Silicone Spray Lube. From your local Airsoft shop, or even online, Amazon carries it too!

Personally I Swear by "Team Associated - Green Slime". It is meant as a silicone based shock lube, for silicone oil filled shocks. This stuff is $2.50 a tube available at most hobby stores, or online. I use it for EVERYTHING. Gears, O-Rings, Piston, Piston head.. Etc. I have found there is NO problems in doing so. I tore down my CA M15A4 @ 1100 rounds, to upgrade it's spring, and piston head. I used this grease. That was over 35,000 rounds ago. All the gun has ever seen is a teardown, cleaning, and re-lube.
Tower Hobbies $2.39 a tube. or RC Planet $2.35 a tube.






Something for everyone to think about... CRC's 808 "Pure Silicone Spray Lube" is:....
30-60% Liquified Petrolem Gas (LPG),
30-60% NAPTHA, You should know this is what "ronsonol" lighter fluid is made of.
10-30% Silicone. WTF.... Pure silicone spray my censored2.gif ...

What this means to you is: The petroleum byproducts, distilates, etc... They are used in the manufacture process of many plastics and rubbers. While this is not any news of shock value. What do you think will happen when you expose an item (hopup rubber, etc.) to the same chemicals used to manufacture it. Yep, you got it. It's going to change it! And not in a good way either.


While I am not completely against the use of Lithium Grease (specifically the thinner "White Lithium") variety. I believe it needs to be pointed out that it IS hygroscopic. Meaning it WILL absorb water. The bad part of this is, in doing so, the oil used to blend and thin it down gets displaced. This allows the lithium grease to thicken into a very thick paste and basically cause binding.

Also, Silicone lubricants are based off of "weight" (aka thickness). You will find everything from "0 weight" spray silicone, to upwards of 45wt shock oil. -=- I do NOT recommend using Silicone OIL's (be it spray, or drip bottle) varieties in the gearbox. Only Silicone Grease!





Cross posted with Soviet911's permission.
QUOTE (soviet911 @ Jan 31 2010, 09:55 PM) *
DuPont Teflon Silicone Lubricant test.

Table of contents

1) Chemical info of the Dupont Teflon Silicon Lubricant.
2) Analysis of Chemical compounds
3) Burn tests
4) Conclusion


1 Contents

Petroleum Distillates CAS 64742-89-8 Use- Solvent
These are very volatile and flammable, this means in theory that they evaporate and ignite easily
Wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naphtha

Propane CAS 74-98-6 self explanatory

Butane CAS 106-97-8 self explanatory

Silicone CAS 63148-62-9 regular silicone oil
Wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polydimethylsiloxane

Teflon flourpolymer. This is like Teflon coating but the DuPont special formula, it should be good lubricant for any application as it one of the least reactive things on this planet with extremely low friction…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polytetrafluoroethylene

Acetone CAS 67-64-1 Extremely volatile with boiling point at 56 C 133F at 1 atm means it easily evaporates but can cause damage to plastics and rubber on contact even though unlikely. In our case its use is to dilute the silicon so it sprays out.
MSDAhttp://www.jtbaker.com/msds/englishhtml/a0446.htm

Aliphatic hydrocarbon CAS 64742-47-8 wide range of boiling points and can be volatile and non volatile, it can be very reactive and not reactive at all. This poses an interesting question of it being dangerous to our airsoft guns or not. The chances of this being a non volatile substance and at the same time being reactive and degrading are very low and I would bet it is most likely something like methane which can occur in a propane butane environment.
Wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aliphatic_compound



2 Analysis of information

1) Everything that’s not silicone or Teflon lubricants should easly evaporate or burn off.
2) Concentration of the pure lubricant (silicon Teflon solution) should be easily achieved by boiling to about 150 degrees C


3 My burn tests

Setup Aluminum can for a test surface above mentioned silicon lubricant and a bic lighter

Burning test Of DuPont Silicon lubricant

Right after
The solution easily ignited showing the presence of alcohol and acetone the solution burned until a thick oil substance left the composition is assume to be silicon oil Teflon and solvent non reactive hydrocarbon chains which would be the cause of the liquid substance. And at most 1% of any reactive volatile substances (alcohol acetone etc)
Video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vRiXA366dE

30 min after
The solution didn’t ignite and was already as previously mentioned thick oil substance when another spray of silicon oil followed the two layers didn’t inter mix and a thick and thinned out liquid were present. The liquid easily ignited as before.
Video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VINnALHrFx8

Test of gun oil Silicon Spray For air gun & Model Gun Siries purchased at airsoft Gi
http://www.airsoftgi.com/product_info.php?products_id=3301

Airsoft oil test.
Right after spraying.
Ignited left an oily substance behind.
Video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=husqVqtHHk8

4) Analysis of results

The burn test showed that all of the volatile substances easly ignite and are present in high concentration at spray signifying that the spray should NOT be used directly on only ruber/plastic part as they might get damaged, this also means spraying this lube into gas mags is not a good idea since non of the volatile hydro carbons will evaporate and will come out when you shoot possibly damaging your gun.
This test also showed that the volatile and reactive hydro carbons are easly removed through evaporation or burning off. Evaporation being the best solution.

What all this means?
Off the shelf silicon lubricants that are spray based will ALWAYS contain some thought of solvent, and in most cases they are reactive and volatile. What my tests so far showed is that most of the volatile and reactive hydro carbons and alcohols are removable, but this doesn’t mean that the final solution is pure silicone oil and still can possibly react with plastics and rubber.

I’m going use this oil to lubricate my WE 1911 and possibly cylinder in my VSS to see how well it works, and in name of science, but only after proper evaporation procedure.

Does this mean you should use it?
Its up to you, you saw the normal Pure silicon oil ignite and Dupont oil ignite what does it mean to you?
It should be noted that chemical reactions are complex and its all at your own risk.

Any concerns post here, I am going to update this with More tests hopefuly a boiling point of both oil, and IR spectra, but it depends on my free time.




See post # 75 in this thread for my comments.
xsboredom
Fantastic ;] I think this is pin worthy a-thumbsup.gif
SuRgE
Ditto on the Green Slime and shock oil! Works perfectly on my setups.
OpSic66
QUOTE (SuRgE @ Jun 10 2008, 07:07 PM) *
Ditto on the Green Slime and shock oil! Works perfectly on my setups.

I basically do not agree with "average airsofters", using "silicone shock oil"...

Mainly because:
People use heavy weights (0 weight is the best choice),
Tend to forget about it and not clean it up.
Tend to over apply it.

Again with proper maint jobs, this is really a non-issue. I actually use Team Associated 0 weight myself, but very sparingly.


QUOTE (xsboredom2 @ Jun 10 2008, 07:05 PM) *
Fantastic ;] I think this is pin worthy a-thumbsup.gif

Thanks, but I guess the mods will see about that.
BroodRed
+1 for pin.

This absolutely needs to be pinned. Several times a month, people post topics like, "omgz what lube should I uze?!" or, "airsoft silicone oil is expensive, can I use (insert 100% silicone oil brand here)?"

Oh, and NO WD-40 or real steel gun greases. I know we all know not to use it, but newer players do not.
GoLgo 13
+1 on pin
+1 on green slime

also, permatex dielectric grease from autozone is 100% silicone and 5.99 a tube(great for cylinder/airseal components),
you can also get permatex white lithium in a tube for 2.99 for gears

look for grey tubes.
OpSic66
BroodRed & GoLgo13, thanks guys I added your info.

If anyone has comments, questions, advice, ranting2.gif... You name it...

Add it to the thread, and we can go from there!
skimmy518
nice opsic! never again shall people ask about lube!
OpSic66
Update...

Stay the heck away,.... From any lubrication, or cleaning products that contain "Corrosion Inhibitors".

Most of them are petroleum based.
BoNZi
I got this stuff at Lowe's and its Teflon Lubricant. On the back it says safe on rubber, plastic, metal and many more items. I have used it for 2 years in my AEG's and GBB's and have had zero problems.
OpSic66
QUOTE (IIBoOgYII @ Jul 4 2008, 08:52 PM) *
I got this stuff at Lowe's and its Teflon Lubricant. On the back it says safe on rubber, plastic, metal and many more items. I have used it for 2 years in my AEG's and GBB's and have had zero problems.

Read the ingredients and THEN decide for yourself.

As I have posted in a different thread. They generally will not cause instantanious failure. They will generally cause random delayed failure for "odd" reasons.
god_of_thunder
Hey umm I know it says don't use lube with petroleum distilates adn stuff but ive heard that what those do is damage rubber hop ups, but the stuff I found in my basement has petroleum distilates but says its safe for rubber

are there still other things that could be damaged by these petroleum by products?
xpxdoo
What do you guys think about Guarder Teflon Grease?
xsboredom
QUOTE (xpxdoo @ Jul 24 2008, 02:43 PM) *
What do you guys think about Guarder Teflon Grease?



I love it a-laugh.gif

That's all I use now apart from silicon oil. I might go try that green bike one soon though.
BoNZi
QUOTE (xpxdoo @ Jul 24 2008, 05:43 PM) *
What do you guys think about Guarder Teflon Grease?

It's pretty good, but I got this stuff from NAPA Auto Parts that is non petroleum based and has silicon in it. It makes your gears glide extremely smoothly.
Airsoft AK47
I've actually used liquid wrench in my Ak47 and it hasn't damaged it at all. This was 10k rounds ago and it still performs fine. I got it from my local Home Depot.
CQBsr47
I use a teflon impregnated PTFE grease lubricant that is meant for aluminum paintball internals and is safe on o ring rubber but it works for me, for pretty much everything from cylinders and piston heads to gears and screw threads works great, ive tested it on a 550 fps gun and high 30+ rof setups and it works great.
night4x
is super lube safe to use? doesnt have any ingredients listed but on there webpage it says safe for plastics
OpSic66
QUOTE (OpSic66 @ Jul 4 2008, 08:01 PM) *
Read the ingredients and THEN decide for yourself.
As I have posted in a different thread. They generally will not cause instantanious failure. They will generally cause random delayed failure for "odd" reasons.
QUOTE (Airsoft AK47 @ Dec 22 2008, 07:36 PM) *
I've actually used liquid wrench in my Ak47 and it hasn't damaged it at all. This was 10k rounds ago and it still performs fine. I got it from my local Home Depot.
Good luck with that...



QUOTE (night4x @ Jan 4 2009, 09:12 AM) *
is super lube safe to use? doesnt have any ingredients listed but on there webpage it says safe for plastics
You can check the manufacturers site for an "MSDS", which will list all the ingredients. If anything in there matches what I listed above, find something else.

IIRC, KrYpTiK on here, uses that stuff, and swears by it though.
crazyairsoft3r
QUOTE (OpSic66 @ Jan 4 2009, 03:11 PM) *
Good luck with that...



You can check the manufacturers site for an "MSDS", which will list all the ingredients. If anything in there matches what I listed above, find something else.

IIRC, KrYpTiK on here, uses that stuff, and swears by it though.




so NO vaseline???
coasterj21
Thanks for the excellent info. I actually have 3 RC cars and tubes of silicon shock oil stored in my basement. Would 20wt be an acceptable lubricant, or should I purchase 0wt?

Thanks
CAINuKe
QUOTE (coasterj21 @ Jan 4 2009, 04:36 PM) *
Thanks for the excellent info. I actually have 3 RC cars and tubes of silicon shock oil stored in my basement. Would 20wt be an acceptable lubricant, or should I purchase 0wt?

Thanks


I think 30wt is the max you can put in it with out bogging down.(Team Associated all the way!)
OpSic66
Don't use silicone oil. It won't stick to anything. And you DON'T need to lube your barrel or BB's.

I haven't lubed my barrel OR BB's - EVER. I do, over use the silicone lube one the FIRST pass when cleaning my barrel. So as the hopup bucking can get some on it. I then do 2-3 more passes (until the clothes start to look clean)..
Shredder_SCS
I have been using Super Lube Grease w/ Syncolon (PTFE) for quite a number of years and it works great! I use it for lubing the gears, cylinder (very thin film), o-rings and the outside surface of the hop bucking to keep it from drying up.

I used to spray silicone lubricant inside the barrel but it doesn't do the barrel any good. It produces a thin film which makes it tacky (in a small way) and it attracts dust particles. What I do to clean my barrel is to use a degreaser (easily removes bb residue) with some clean cotton strips until all the residue is removed. I get better results when doing this. Hope this helps... a-salute.gif
hightower
QUOTE (OpSic66 @ Jun 10 2008, 09:52 PM) *
Permatex dielectric grease. From autozone it's 100% silicone, and 5.99 a tube. Great for cylinder/airseal components. (Thanks GoLgo 13)
Permatex white lithium grease. Again from autozone in a tube for $2.99, works great for gears.


So I've finally convinced myself to open up a non-lpeg gearbox. I've always been worried about screwing up my high-end gun or something.
But first I wanted to make sure I had MOST of the materials.

So I walked into Advance Auto Parts today and asked the lady at the counter where both of these items were. She immediately led me over to the grease section (first time I've been in the store so I had no idea where to go) and found both of them for me.
I paid about $9 with tax, so about $4 or so a tube.
+1 for the greases
+1 for Advance Auto Parts a-thumbsup.gif


I'm glad I found this guide because you can pay $15 online for just gear grease (on ASGI at least...) and another $15 on piston and other greases.
The point is, I saved a ton of money by buying the Permatex grease locally, and not buying brand-name greases such as CA or guarder. And by doing my own GB work, I'll save from those labor fees and whatnot.


I figured I'd put that in to show some other users how easy and efficient it is to use alternatives to brand-name stuff. Doing a tad of research will go a long way. a-thumbsup.gif
Thanks OpSic66!!!!
maruipro
Lets say your friend put some petroleum based white lithium grease on to their gun's gears.
Its been there for about 2 weeks.
If he cleans all of it off now, would there still be damage to the rubber stuff?? or will it be minimized?
OpSic66
QUOTE (maruipro @ Jan 26 2009, 12:15 AM) *
Lets say your friend put some petroleum based white lithium grease on to their gun's gears.
Its been there for about 2 weeks.
If he cleans all of it off now, would there still be damage to the rubber stuff?? or will it be minimized?


Well thankfully the plastics in the gear box are pretty resilient to short term contact. I would say with a good cleaning (with again, a NON hydro-carbon based cleaning solution) would do good to get most of the harmful gunk out of there.
maruipro
QUOTE (OpSic66 @ Jan 26 2009, 12:27 PM) *
Well thankfully the plastics in the gear box are pretty resilient to short term contact. I would say with a good cleaning (with again, a NON hydro-carbon based cleaning solution) would do good to get most of the harmful gunk out of there.


thanks. and one last quick question.
are piston head o-rings made of rubber or silicon, because if its made of silicon, you can put petroleum based grease on it.
just curious, not that I would do it.

And also, I already wiped out the petroleum grease in my friend's gearbox with a towel, and relubed with proper grease.
xsboredom
I am pretty sure it is rubber.

I always clean my metal parts with automotive brake cleaner >__>; pain.gif eats through any grease .
YesOfficer
I just installed a new bucking and nub on my rifle, while I was out today I swung by Pep Boys to take a look at their lubricants. I tried looking for something that said 100% silicone, but the closest thing I could find was Pyroil Multi-Purpose Silicone Lubricant. It says its safe for rubber gaskets, but the ingredients listed are Heptane, Carbon Dioxide, and Dimethyl Polysiloxane.....and of course the OP said not to use stuff with Heptane. Im new to this stuff, so why does the can say safe for rubber?
hanjieyu86
hey I just recently used the permatex dielectric grease on 3 of my airsoft guns and all 3 immediated began having inconsistent fps. each has the symptom of sometimes shooting around 200 fps and sometimes around 300. I wiped excess grease off but it still is the same. Anyone know whats wrong?
Annun Cirith
I'm going to guess you either put too much on, or got it in a place where it's interfering with the seals somehow. This could mean either sticking together, or not allowing the parts to seal where they should, such as nozzle/hop contact or piston o-ring seals. See if there's excess and clear up the contact points.
prem205
So what happens if you do use some lubricant that is flamible???
Ive been using Tri-Flow which is the lube that ive always used in paintball guns, which is fine on plastic and rubber as it is mostly used on orings on a bolt in a paintball gun.

So the can says it contains Hydro-Carbons and is flamible...is it bad for an airsoft gun?
OpSic66
QUOTE (prem205 @ Feb 15 2009, 02:01 AM) *
So what happens if you do use some lubricant that is flamible???
Ive been using Tri-Flow which is the lube that ive always used in paintball guns, which is fine on plastic and rubber as it is mostly used on orings on a bolt in a paintball gun.

So the can says it contains Hydro-Carbons and is flamible...is it bad for an airsoft gun?


Use your better judgment. Your gearbox contains an electrical contact, that produces a spark. I'll bet if you check that can, it says keep away from open flame / sparks.
prem205
QUOTE (OpSic66 @ Feb 15 2009, 01:07 PM) *
Use your better judgment. Your gearbox contains an electrical contact, that produces a spark. I'll bet if you check that can, it says keep away from open flame / sparks.

Alright, I guess no Triflow then. I always thought all canned sprays say that because its pressurized.

but I just sprayed some on the floor and threw a match in it, and damn...erupted in flames....

So this is the correct lube right: http://www.autozone.com/R,4392776/store,28...oductDetail.htm

Back says it contains: Polydimethylsiloxane and Amorphous silica
Stealthmaster14
I have white lithium grease from homedepot and it says petroleum based. (Huge black tube) I've been using it for a while on the gears and I haven't had problem. There is even some that got on the tappet plate and I haven't noticed anything abnormal.

http://www.nanaimomarinecentre.com/catalog...s/LUB11354.jpeg

tube on the far right
OpSic66
While Lithium Grease works. I personally do not prefer it.

While white lithium grease is not known to be "Hygroscopic", I know for a fact it is not a water displacing lubricant. Now this causes 2 problems.

1: Lithium can thicken, and the oil will leach from it. Leaving the lithium in a very cake like paste.
2: it allows water retention, which can and WILL speed up electrolytic reactions between the various metal differences in the gearbox. (side note: This is why I am STRONGLY against copper shims, on a steel gear shaft, against a steel bushing, in a zinc alloy gearbox - Combinations of metals from different family's create a battery like atmosphere when mixed with certain chemicals, and even the moisture in the air).
Stealthmaster14
White Lithium seems to repel water fairly well in my experience. AZ is incredibly dry though, so moisture isn't an issue.

So are you saying that it can ignite inside the gearbox or what?
OpSic66
QUOTE (Stealthmaster14 @ Feb 20 2009, 07:28 PM) *
White Lithium seems to repel water fairly well in my experience. AZ is incredibly dry though, so moisture isn't an issue.

So are you saying that it can ignite inside the gearbox or what?


Anything that is flammable, can always be ignited. The "flash point" is what is important. As for Lithium Grease, yeah it can be ignited. It would definitely take some doing to get that to happen. But items that are HIGH in content of Hydro Carbons, or other flammable substances will have a warning on the container about open flame or sparks.
Stealthmaster14
I'm not saying it isn't possible, but correct me if I'm wrong, thousands of airsofters use white lithium on their gearboxes (and several people use copper shims) and I have never heard of failure. The sparks are inside the "contact box" and it would it be pretty insane if a spark somehow managed to leap out and ignite the grease.

I'm not really worried about it. If it somehow managed to ignite, the worst that could happen would be the gearbox would be damaged. I doubt the fire would be strong enough to burn through the shell. lol

thanks for the heads up though. I would use alternatives, but being a minor (and not being to obtain a license yet), a job isn't really ideal right now especially since I'm busy with school, so money is tight with me. White lithium is dirt cheap and you get a butt load.
cmjelenc
One guy says he thinks 30wt shock fluid is ok does any body know for positive if its ok.
thanks
BushmanSniper
Phantom Teflon AEG Gearbox Grease. I swear by this stuff. never ever had any issues with any of my 3 guns or any of my friends 9 total guns. works on metal and plastic parts.

CAUTION: May cause skin irritation. In case of eye contact, flush with wather for 15 minutes; call a psysician, for skin contact, wash thoroughly with soap and water.
(just putting this up here in case of any skin sensative people)
OpSic66
QUOTE (cmjelenc @ Mar 7 2009, 07:25 PM) *
One guy says he thinks 30wt shock fluid is ok does any body know for positive if its ok.
thanks


No, any "liquid" lube is going to be all bad. You want a grease that has some sort of adhesion quality, so it sticks to parts.
Gioco
I hate to burst everyone's bubble, but you do not have to use 100% silicon lube or any other lubricant that doesn't have petroleum in it. Somebody somewhere along the way made that up so they could make more money off of their silicon lubricant. Here's how I found this out:

I used to play paintball (I owned a Tippmann 98 Custom) and my marker's manual said to use Hoppe's 9 oil (a real steel firearm lubricant that does contain petroleum) if I didn't have any regular marker oil. Well, I never had any regular marker oil, so I always used Hoppe's 9. I used it on the plastics, on the metals... on everything in my paintball gun. That marker played without flaw for about four to four and a half years straight. I never had to replace anything.

So then I switched to airsoft and all I ever heard was, "NEVER use anything with petroleum in it!!!!" However, upon taking apart my gearbox for the first time, I couldn't tell the difference between the plastics in it and the plastics in my paintball marker. So I did some research and found this site: http://www.protectall.com/artmyths.htm. So, because I have ready access to tons of Hoppe's oil, I figured I would do an experiment since I'm going to end up upgrading everything in my AEG anyway. So I took apart my AEG, thoroughly cleaned every single last piece with a toothbrush and Dawn, and liberally applied Hoppe's 9 oil to everything (even the plastics) when I put it all back together. It has been over a week since I've done that, and everything in my AEG is working just like it did the day I bought it. I've taken it apart every day just to make sure, and the plastics haven't melted or started getting softer or anything like that. They feel just as strong as when I first took the gearbox apart.

So don't believe the rumors! However, DO NOT use WD-40 because that will destroy plastics and don't use anything intended for automotive use as it's stronger (and therefore more corrosive) and just too thick for airsoft use in the first place. Also read everything on the link I posted because it's all very informative. So, if you have silicon lube and you can get it for cheaper than other lubricants, then use it! But if you're in my situation where you can get stuff like Hoppe's very easily and for dirt cheap, then use it! It will not hurt your gun.

If you don't believe me, then by all means stick with silicon, but I think this whole thing got started through false advertising and stuff like that angers me, so I'm here to get the truth out.
OpSic66
QUOTE (Gioco @ Apr 4 2009, 08:38 PM) *
If you don't believe me, then by all means stick with silicon, but I think this whole thing got started through false advertising and stuff like that angers me, so I'm here to get the truth out.


I don't advertise, nor work for any company involved. And as you, I started out in paintball. I also worked hand in hand with a tech that was trained @ Indian Creek Paintball (aka ICD). They swear by DOW 33, as do a couple other companies.


I started into the investigation of "similar" or appropriate lower cost replacement lubes, while I worked as a heavy equipment shop. I had access to MSDS sheets, and product literature for literally thousands of lubricants from greases to hydraulic oil.

I learned 1 major thing. Hydro-Carbon based chemicals are used to produce many of the items used in paintball, airsoft, and other guns. The plastics, and rubbers used, can ALL be harmed by them. Now granted, exposure over time is the cause for breakdown. NONE of the MSDS paperwork, or product literature lists "Exposure Time" for sensitive items, it is just flat out not required by law, to be done. So it is never tested.

What I say, and what I stick to is: Why would you for any sort of convenience, use a chemical that will harm (again, over an unknown amount of time), the items in a gearbox. To me that just makes NO sense, of any kind, at all. Granted, a gearbox will need repair over time anyways. But why accelerate failure?

I have a CA M15A4 gearbox, that made it to over 100,000 rnds. I attribute that to the brand of lube I used, since most of the parts in it were STOCK, minus a spring and piston head.
Gioco
Yes, over time they probably will start to affect the plastics, but that time has to be so long that it's almost negligible. My paintball marker has, for four straight years (and that's not including the time before that), had constant contact with Hoppe's 9 oil, and it's still working like it was brand new. But, like I said earlier, if you just feel more comfortable with silicon or white lithium grease, or whatever, then stick with that. I personally prefer Hoppe's for the reasons stated in my last post.

I'm just saying that people are making petroleum lubricants sound so much more harmful than they really are. Everywhere I go, it sounds like people are saying that nearly instantaneously, petroleum lubes will start harming your gun. That's just not true (for the lighter lubricants, such as Hoppe's). If it will hurt the plastics, it's going to take a long time, as evidenced by my 4+ year old paintball marker, which still works perfectly fine.

I'm not trying to start an argument, I'm just getting the facts straight. As a final statement to clear everything up, petroleum based lubricants will harm plastics, but not nearly as fast or as bad as people make them out do (unless, of course, it's something heavier, like for automotive use).
OpSic66
QUOTE (Gioco @ Apr 6 2009, 06:19 PM) *
I'm not trying to start an argument, I'm just getting the facts straight. As a final statement to clear everything up, petroleum based lubricants will harm plastics, but not nearly as fast or as bad as people make them out do (unless, of course, it's something heavier, like for automotive use).


Bingo. You just hit the exact reason I am speaking about lube's. 90% of what people are purchasing are from Automotive or Hardware supply centers, which are pretty much "industrial" grade junk.

Some of the better made gun oils and lubes (again, without the harsh corrosion inhibitors) are not that bad at all. However, for the cost of them. Negligable benefit to cost offset. a-thumbsup.gif
Airsoft AK47
QUOTE (OpSic66 @ Jan 4 2009, 04:11 PM) *
Good luck with that...


On the can it says "100% HEAVY DUTY Silicone Spray, Waterproof, Rustproof & Lubricates. For Rubber, Wood, Plastic, Vinyl & Metal."

I cleaned my barrel 4 months ago and their is no change in performance, or any failures. Liquid Wrench seems safe to me.
jlui83
will the permatex white lithium grease work for my GBB slides?
joedirtbike418
Okay I have read a lot of this post and want to ask a question. Sorry if its been answered, but I'd rather not screw up my gun. For the gear box, would white lithium or teflon grease be better? Which of the two wouldn't break down in the presense of silicone spray better? The reason I ask is because the owners manual says to spray silicone spray in the bb feeding hole on the gun so that it can drip into the gear box. My other question is what should I use to clean the barrel and should I use silicone on a cleaning cloth in the barrel after I clean it?

Almost forgot, is dielectric grease the best lube to use for the piston/air seal components? Thanks.
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