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ARES screwed me over China Lake designs


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25 replies to this topic

#1 renegadecow

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 09:17 AM

So last year I made a replica China Lake grenade launcher. I won categories in the build off competition, got in agreement with a company to make them, got some spending money and all is happy. Only I wasn't paid. Copy pasted from vietnam-airsoft:


"As many of you know, in the past year I was in agreement with an airsoft manufacturer to produce my China Lake grenade launcher. I was not at liberty to divulge their identity back then, but seeing how things have gone sour now I can point out that ARES has officially shafted me. Everything was going smoothly until they decided to violate our contract by demanding detailed internal pictures of a real steel 40mm China Lake grenade launcher (was never in our agreement) to get the full payment out of them after I've already submitted to them the complete 3D CAD files. What infuriates me is that I never asked for much at all (only 2k USD!) out good faith because I of all people wanted this to become a reality and wanted to help them out as best I can. I never intended to get a lot out of this, but instead I get cheated out of it. So now I have to contact a 2nd company quick and sell them complete rights to my designs so they can take ARES to court should they decided to continue and rip off my work."


Let this be a warning to enterprising individuals who might have a design or two up their sleeve that may want to sell. Don't sell them to ARES.
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You wanna die with a man's gun. Not a little sissy gun like that.

#2 BBSlinger

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 09:53 AM

I made a reply on Arnies to. But I will tell you here also.

It's really sad to see companies do that, because your China Lake was something to behold. In all honesty, 2k USD is a CHEAP asking price for a design like that.
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#3 airborne101

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 10:35 AM

Renegade, why not screw them back? Post up pictures of the contract that they breech, then, post up all the detail design info pertaining to the China Lake so that ANYONE can make it. I mean, it wouldn't exactly be a crying shame if G&P found the design stuff here and started making one because it would inevitably be better than the ARES one. Either that, or take it to another company.

Edited by airborne101, 25 January 2013 - 10:37 AM.

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#4 Coyote98

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 11:18 AM

Everybody with all their evil thoughts... It's so great...

But really, just find some other company. ARES kind of just took all of your happiness. TAKE IT BACK!

Edited by Coyote98, 25 January 2013 - 11:18 AM.

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#5 EGOKILLER

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 11:50 AM

WOW! and I was just looking at the Ares MS338, this has got me thinking and has changed my mind. Guess I'll have to wait for the G&P model to come out which I'm sure will have more aftermarket upgradability anyways and not be as proprietary as most Ares guns are. I hope things work out for you and hope more ASF members see this thread, ARES PRODUCTS SHOULD NO LONGER HAVE A PLACE ON THIS FORUM!
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#6 wolfgeorge

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 12:00 PM

Man I'm sorry to hear that... You're an innovator of airsoft!
Sad to see well known companies like Ares to do such acts!
Since you have a contract then you can take it to the courts!

It doesn't matter if it's for $2000 or 2 cent, it's a contract violation.

Here in Greece we have a saying... " Be careful where you put your signature and you p<AT>nis!"

Hope all to end well mate, it's really a sad this happened.


Wolf
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#7 Soaring Alex

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 12:08 PM

I have never owned an ARES product, and after reading this I don't think I ever will.
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#8 Dawnzero

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 12:09 PM

Sounds like the Stuffed Crust Pizza Hut law suit.

Outline:
Guy makes suffed crust by mistake, takes it to pizza hut. Pizza hut screws him over.

Edited by Dawnzero, 25 January 2013 - 12:10 PM.

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#9 EchoRecon3

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 12:35 PM

This is a horrible situation to be in, sorry that ARES is shafting you. Like others have said, lawyer up and go to court. We'll do the best we can spreading the word.
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#10 Tomtortoise

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 12:37 PM

QUOTE (renegadecow @ Jan 25 2013, 09:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
So last year I made a replica China Lake grenade launcher. I won categories in the build off competition, got in agreement with a company to make them, got some spending money and all is happy. Only I wasn't paid. Copy pasted from vietnam-airsoft:


"As many of you know, in the past year I was in agreement with an airsoft manufacturer to produce my China Lake grenade launcher. I was not at liberty to divulge their identity back then, but seeing how things have gone sour now I can point out that ARES has officially shafted me. Everything was going smoothly until they decided to violate our contract by demanding detailed internal pictures of a real steel 40mm China Lake grenade launcher (was never in our agreement) to get the full payment out of them after I've already submitted to them the complete 3D CAD files. What infuriates me is that I never asked for much at all (only 2k USD!) out good faith because I of all people wanted this to become a reality and wanted to help them out as best I can. I never intended to get a lot out of this, but instead I get cheated out of it. So now I have to contact a 2nd company quick and sell them complete rights to my designs so they can take ARES to court should they decided to continue and rip off my work."


Let this be a warning to enterprising individuals who might have a design or two up their sleeve that may want to sell. Don't sell them to ARES.



So does this mean its time to complain to ARES in the form of email complaints?

Did you agree not to send the files to anyone else or anything that could result in another company having instructions to make them?
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#11 renegadecow

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 01:03 PM

QUOTE (Tomtortoise @ Jan 26 2013, 01:37 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Did you agree not to send the files to anyone else or anything that could result in another company having instructions to make them?

That was part of our negotiations, yes. But they've broken the contract by refusing to pay me and inserting a ridiculous requirement which was never brought up in the first place. What's also written in out contract is that breaking any of the terms on their part entitles me to sell full rights (technically I was only allowing ARES to borrow my designs, not claim ownership to it) of my design to a different manufacturer which is very likely what I'll be doing.
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You wanna die with a man's gun. Not a little sissy gun like that.

#12 BBSlinger

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 01:54 PM

Hmm..


So your going to try G&P or ICS?
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#13 SecondWind

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 03:00 PM

Did OP have a legal professional give the contract a once over to make sure it was solid?

ARES...
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#14 renegadecow

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 09:12 PM

^
No. And by solid I you mean having clauses involving penalties should they break contract? They would have broken them just the same. Will try shooting ICS an email. G&P a close 2nd since they're heavy on Nam equipment but I do recall them taking pride in that all their designs are in-house so not sure if they'll entertain buying them.
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You wanna die with a man's gun. Not a little sissy gun like that.

#15 GoLgo 13

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 10:12 PM

That is BS renegade! But at the same time it is awesome that your design was so awesome that they considered producing it as their own. Let us know how it turns out with company #2 a-salute.gif
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#16 vanevery

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 10:24 PM

QUOTE (airborne101 @ Jan 25 2013, 10:35 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
it wouldn't exactly be a crying shame if G&P found the design stuff here and started making one because it would inevitably be better than the ARES one. Either that, or take it to another company.


I am sure Modify would be interested.

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#17 Penguin_Mojito

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 10:53 PM

Am I smelling an ARES boycott?

This is very messed up. If this product is actually released by ARES, we need to make everyone who wants to buy one aware of the true origins.

Edited by Penguin_Mojito, 25 January 2013 - 11:06 PM.

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#18 EGOKILLER

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 11:02 PM

Or make everyone aware before its release so that ares sales go to sh**

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#19 Ranger420

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 11:48 PM

Boycott Ares!
I agree! I know that I will never buy anything they make. I'm so sorry they screwed you like that buddy. If your ok with this, I will post a Boycott Ares on my website with a link back to this for you. I only get bolt action snipers on my site but its still a start. I will also post a link to this on Airsoft Sniper forum "if your cool with it of course!

Keep us posted on whats going on with this,please...
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#20 Bladez 0f Fury

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 05:01 AM

Just when I was going to buy my second ARES/STAR MG36 mag... The conflict of having the Best Cmag or Boycotting them. I guess I could Gearwhore for a while :3

Anyways, I hope everything goes well and I wouldn't sue them just yet. I would patent the design, and if ARES uses your design then sue. You would get a much bigger claim and it would spread the word of ARES being a POS much more than suing right now. However I hope the second company doesn't screw you over, your china lake is awesome and needs to be made!

Edited by Bladez 0f Fury, 26 January 2013 - 05:02 AM.

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#21 renegadecow

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 06:01 AM

Ok, just got this from ICS:

"Hello Carlos,

Thank you very much for putting us in your first consideration, we’re very appreciated your offer.
However, we need to do a market research to know the potential of this product.

I hope you don’t mind I put the video on our FB fan page, hope to get the feedback from fans and see if they’re crazy about it.

Here is our FB page: https://www.facebook.com/ICSairsoftgun

Best Regardr
Francis"

Basically they've put up my video on their Facebook page. If you want them to make my China Lake then do voice it out in their comments.
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You wanna die with a man's gun. Not a little sissy gun like that.

#22 EGOKILLER

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 07:16 AM

"Liked" and "Commented" wish u the best of luck!
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#23 Shadowex3

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 08:55 AM

Something I learned when I was a legal studies undergrad: *ALWAYS* get a lawyer to go over the contract, and never do business with China.

I hope this works out for you mate. Just remember run it by a lawyer, just because they broke the contract doesn't mean they won't still try to use it against you.
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#24 BBSlinger

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 06:44 PM

Like, Commented, and Shared! Hope they make it!
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#25 socalpunisher

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 01:07 AM

Fist off that is horrid!!!! I am so sorry to hear that! It makes me sick to hear crap like this! I have been in a similar situation with designs I had for air intake parts when I was in the Auto Industry. Thanks Full Throttle you theiving bastards. But I digress!

So I hope it works out.

I truley hope that ICS picks it up. I think it will make a big boom in there market as they do alot of period gins and they hav e slew of grenade product coming out.

I wish you all the luck in the world.
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#26 borcky90

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 05:37 PM

Liked, commented and shared good luck!
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