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Aznspartan

G&G or Creation Hop Up Chamber

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Well, I guess the title is pretty much self explanitory.

 

Here are links

 

G&G

http://www.airsoftgi.com/product_info.php?products_id=6424

 

Creation

http://www.airsoftpost.com/product_info.ph...oducts_id=25742

 

Or if better, if anyone can shoot me a link to a Best Gun that isnt sold out :D

 

 

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If you're looking for a conversion kit to use VSR barrels you need either the Best Gun or King Arms chambers. The G&G and Creation are just the chambers where as the Best Gun and KA come with the extra parts needed to fit the new barrels.

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If you're looking for a conversion kit to use VSR barrels you need either the Best Gun or King Arms chambers. The G&G and Creation are just the chambers where as the Best Gun and KA come with the extra parts needed to fit the new barrels.

 

Sorry im still new on hop ups, so the King Arms VSR conversion comes with an aluminum chamber? because I bought ym Tanaka used, and the plastic chamber is all cracked.

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I may be getting my terminology mixed up, I want to get the King Arms VSR conversion kit, but what I am asking is, does it come with the "Hub" (if my terminology is right). in other words, this black part right here thats crack

 

dscn1022m.jpg

 

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dscn1023h.jpg

 

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Edited by Aznspartan

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I may be getting my terminology mixed up, I want to get the King Arms VSR conversion kit, but what I am asking is, does it come with the "Hub" (if my terminology is right). in other words, this black part right here thats crack

 

No, it doesn't come with the hub, you'll need to buy that seperately.

 

16a62h3.jpg

 

The top part of the picture is what the King Arms conversion kit comes with, namely the hop up unit itself, a nub, a spacer,

a barrel end, a nozzle and a metal tool to help install the nozzle without damaging it. In the lower left part you can see how it would fit in the hub.

 

It seems both parts are often being called the chamber, but the KJW manual states the outer part as being the barrel housing. No idea what Tanaka calls it though, I don't have the manual for my rifle.

So while nobody seems to use the real name, it would make it easier to distinguish the two.

 

link to the King Arms conversion kit

Edited by Tjolbi

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No, it doesn't come with the hub, you'll need to buy that seperately.

 

16a62h3.jpg

 

The top part of the picture is what the King Arms conversion kit comes with, namely the hop up unit itself, a nub, a spacer,

a barrel end, a nozzle and a metal tool to help install the nozzle without damaging it. In the lower left part you can see how it would fit in the hub.

 

It seems both parts are often being called the chamber, but the KJW manual states the outer part as being the barrel housing. No idea what Tanaka calls it though, I don't have the manual for my rifle.

So while nobody seems to use the real name, it would make it easier to distinguish the two.

 

link to the King Arms conversion kit

 

Kool, thnx, now my pother problem, since my hub is cracked, what should I get?

 

If a link is provided to the porduct, would greatly appreciate. Im guessing I need a king arms HUB?

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Kool, thnx, now my pother problem, since my hub is cracked, what should I get?

 

If a link is provided to the porduct, would greatly appreciate. Im guessing I need a king arms HUB?

 

 

If you just want to fix the hub, buy either the 'Creation Aluminum Hopup Chamber' or the 'G&G Hop Up Set',

the ones you linked to yourself in your original post. If you want to get the vsr conversion kit as well (switching over to using vsr cut barrels),

get the King Arms conversion kit + either the 'Creation Aluminum Hopup Chamber' or the 'G&G Hop Up Set'.

 

Creation Aluminum Hopup Chamber

G&G Hop Up Set

King Arms Chamber Conversion Kit

 

I hadn't heard of the G&G chamber before, but from the picture on evike, it looks like it barely has any threading for the barrel nut to screw on to.

So while it's cheaper, I'm not sure if it'll work as well. Maybe someone else has used it before and can tell you more about it.

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If you just want to fix the hub, buy either the 'Creation Aluminum Hopup Chamber' or the 'G&G Hop Up Set',

the ones you linked to yourself in your original post. If you want to get the vsr conversion kit as well (switching over to using vsr cut barrels),

get the King Arms conversion kit + either the 'Creation Aluminum Hopup Chamber' or the 'G&G Hop Up Set'.

 

Creation Aluminum Hopup Chamber

G&G Hop Up Set

King Arms Chamber Conversion Kit

 

I hadn't heard of the G&G chamber before, but from the picture on evike, it looks like it barely has any threading for the barrel nut to screw on to.

So while it's cheaper, I'm not sure if it'll work as well. Maybe someone else has used it before and can tell you more about it.

 

SO the creation Hub is guarantee to work with the KA Conversion?

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Also, with the VSR conversion kit, I need the new tb inner barrel, BUT I also want to get a G&G steel outer barrel, and I read that it requires a 650mm inner, so my question is, can I use this?

 

http://www.airsoftpost.com/product_info.ph...oducts_id=24393

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Also, with the VSR conversion kit, I need the new tb inner barrel, BUT I also want to get a G&G steel outer barrel, and I read that it requires a 650mm inner, so my question is, can I use this?

 

http://www.airsoftpost.com/product_info.ph...oducts_id=24393

 

 

If you want to buy the G&G heavy outer barrel, don't get the the 'Creation Aluminum Hopup Chamber' or the 'G&G Hop Up Set'. It comes with the hub already and it's attached differently as far as I know as well,

that might be why the seperate G&G Hop Up Set has such shallow threads. The outer barrel set includes an inner barrel as well (6.04mm x 650mm) but I imagine it's a tanaka cut, not vsr.

So you'll still need another inner barrel yes, but not the one you linked to, which is for AEG's not the vsr cut you need. The best quality ones are EdGI and PDI, EdGI being fully custom ones if you order directly.

http://www.edgicustom-usa.com/custom_work.php

 

Get the G&G heavy outer barrel, the King Arms conversion kit and either an EdGI or PDI inner barrel (vsr cut).

 

If you're going for an EdGi custom inner barrel, it should be vsr cut, a maximum of 650mm long, standard outer diameter, no bull barrel and no porting (would be rendered useless by the full outer barrel).

You can choose the inner diameter from 5.98mm to 6.05mm. Some people want to stick to the smallest possible diameter, others say a larger one adds a more consistent air cushion and therefore more accuracy.

Neither has been properly and irrefutably proven to be better however, so pick the one you feel will work best. Note however that with low inner diameters (6.00 and below) you'll really have to be careful

about the type of bb's you use, so get some good quality ones that won't get stuck.

 

I personally went for an EdGI 6.01 inner diameter barrel. :)

Edited by Tjolbi

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If you want to buy the G&G heavy outer barrel, don't get the the 'Creation Aluminum Hopup Chamber' or the 'G&G Hop Up Set'. It comes with the hub already and it's attached differently as far as I know as well,

that might be why the seperate G&G Hop Up Set has such shallow threads. The outer barrel set includes an inner barrel as well (6.04mm x 650mm) but I imagine it's a tanaka cut, not vsr.

So you'll still need another inner barrel yes, but not the one you linked to, which is for AEG's not the vsr cut you need. The best quality ones are EdGI and PDI, EdGI being fully custom ones if you order directly.

http://www.edgicustom-usa.com/custom_work.php

 

Get the G&G heavy outer barrel, the King Arms conversion kit and either an EdGI or PDI inner barrel (vsr cut).

 

If you're going for an EdGi custom inner barrel, it should be vsr cut, a maximum of 650mm long, standard outer diameter, no bull barrel and no porting (would be rendered useless by the full outer barrel).

You can choose the inner diameter from 5.98mm to 6.05mm. Some people want to stick to the smallest possible diameter, others say a larger one adds a more consistent air cushion and therefore more accuracy.

Neither has been properly and irrefutably proven to be better however, so pick the one you feel will work best. Note however that with low inner diameters (6.00 and below) you'll really have to be careful

about the type of bb's you use, so get some good quality ones that won't get stuck.

 

I personally went for an EdGI 6.01 inner diameter barrel. :)

 

So I don't need to buy a new Hub, but the one that comes with the G&G barrel will work with the conversion?

 

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kk. So I just found out I have a PCS bolt. What are some upgrades I need and don't need?

 

heres what I am planning to get

 

 

Nine Ball Air Seal HopUp Chamber for Marui GBB & VSR Rifle - $19

 

G&G Knock Arm & Plunge Set for Tanaka M700 / M24 - $20

 

G&G Rubber Set for Tanaka M700 / M24 - $17

 

G&G Steel Cocking Piece for Tanaka M700 / M24 - $27

 

G&G Valve Knocker for Tanaka M700 / M24 - $12

 

King Arms Chamber Conversion Kit for Tanaka M700 A.I.C.S. / M40A1 Airsoft Sniper Rifles - $80

 

G&G M24 Heavy Barrel Set (Tango type) - $138

 

King Arms Aluminum Air Nozzle for Tanaka M700 / A.I.C.S. Sniper Rifle Series (Ver. 2) - $20

 

G&G Gas Route Connector Spring for Tanaka M700 / M24 - $6

 

PolarStar Concave Spacer (PCS) Officially Licensed SCS High Performance Airsoft Hopup Spacer

- $6

Edited by Aznspartan

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kk. So I just found out I have a PCS bolt. What are some upgrades I need and don't need?

 

heres what I am planning to get

 

 

Nine Ball Air Seal HopUp Chamber for Marui GBB & VSR Rifle - $19

Good

 

G&G Knock Arm & Plunge Set for Tanaka M700 / M24 - $20

Good, comes with enough parts for two mags.

 

G&G Rubber Set for Tanaka M700 / M24 - $17

Not strictly necessary, but won't hurt. (you'll only be able to use one of the three parts)

 

G&G Steel Cocking Piece for Tanaka M700 / M24 - $27

This part didn't fit for me, so unless you file it down to the dimensions of the original cocking piece, it probably won't work for you either.

 

G&G Valve Knocker for Tanaka M700 / M24 - $12

Good

 

King Arms Chamber Conversion Kit for Tanaka M700 A.I.C.S. / M40A1 Airsoft Sniper Rifles - $80

Good

 

G&G M24 Heavy Barrel Set (Tango type) - $138

Good

 

King Arms Aluminum Air Nozzle for Tanaka M700 / A.I.C.S. Sniper Rifle Series (Ver. 2) - $20

You won't need this, the King Arms conversion kit already comes with this part.

 

G&G Gas Route Connector Spring for Tanaka M700 / M24 - $6

Good, you will need one for every magazine.

 

PolarStar Concave Spacer (PCS) Officially Licensed SCS High Performance Airsoft Hopup Spacer - $6

The King Arms conversion kit has a completely different hop up nub/spacer so you'll have to do a bit of modding to the PCS to get it to work.

Should be worth it once you get it properly tweaked, but it's not a drop in part. The conversion kit does already come with a hop up nub btw,

so if you don't want to mod the PCS, you can just use the stock one that comes with it.

 

One last upgrade is the G&G Striker Spring, this replaces the stock one with a thicker wired spring, making for more consistent gas release.

Also don't forget the new inner barrel you'll need. :a-wink:

 

With all these upgrades, you might also want to look at converting to external HPA or CO2 instead of using green gas or such, it would make for a far more consistent rifle.

Brainplay has an excellent how-to thread 'Constructing An Air Rig', which I would recommend you read.

Edited by Tjolbi

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If you get all of the above, you should be maxed out as far as performance parts goes, everything else is either tweaking or purely for looks.

Make sure to get a decent regulator if you go HPA or CO2, but apart from that, you should be good.

This is another of Brainplay's threads with a list of some good regulators.

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Last question, So ive heard that it recommended to have a little spacer between the tip of the inner barrel to the inside tip of the outer barrel, is that true? and if it is, what should the length of my inner barrel be?

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I haven't heard of that before, but I doubt it serves any other purpose than to protect the inner barrel from dirt. I'm not an expert on barrel physics however,

so I can't say if there's an optimum length for a gas gun. In general though (with gas guns), the longer the inner barrel, the higher the fps'll be, but above around 300mm you won't get accuracy improvements anymore.

 

Unless someone else has a better suggestion, I'd just go for a 650mm one so it'll be as long as the outer barrel.

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Last question, So ive heard that it recommended to have a little spacer between the tip of the inner barrel to the inside tip of the outer barrel, is that true? and if it is, what should the length of my inner barrel be?

 

That sounds like some garbled information on a real topic which could be one of the following.

 

The stock barrel and Edgi barrels are thicker than the hole in the endcap. However, both have a small lip recessed lip at the end of the inner barrel that fits perfectly inside of the endcap and seats the inner barrel solidly.

 

or

 

A KJW problem was that the aftermarket barrel lengths available are only 590mm and 650mm while the actual barrel length is 622mm thus some would purchase the 590mm and have a gap between the inner barrel and the endcap. This wasn't a good thing though.

 

or

 

Some barrels when assembled incorrectly wouldn't center correctly. Adding a barrel spacer at the end would help align it properly. However, this could also put excess stress on the barrel if used as a crutch rather than a guide. Learning to assemble your rifle correctly was a better fix.

 

None of the above really contribute to extra accuracy.

 

Tjolbi- take a look at the G&G Power PACK (not bolt). It comes with the plunger kit, extra spring, and cocking piece all in one package.

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alright, thnx a bunch guys, im goign to start this project and hopefully be done by mid september, I need to make the money first and with school just starting, the books are making a real dent in my budget.lol

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Correct. The G&G Power Pack comes with the plunger set. The plungers replace the valve knocker.

 

OOO, ok, is there a guide on the forums that show how to disassemble the mag and install these parts? with pictures?

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It comes with the plunger kit, extra spring, and cocking piece all in one package

Like Brainplay said, you can get the G&G Power Pack instead of buying those three parts seperately. I'd forgotten about it, but I think it came out cheaper when I bought it as well.

 

There's a great guide for installing the Power Pack as well as the Gas Route Connector Spring. Which you can find here.

 

Correct. The G&G Power Pack comes with the plunger set. The plungers replace the valve knocker.

 

This is not the case, the Power Pack replaces the striker plate with the plungers, the valve knocker is the part in the trigger group that hits the striker plate or plunger, releasing the gas.

I think you've got the two confused Brainplay.

 

valve knocker:

200x143_airsoft_GG_TanakaM700M24_ValveKnocker.jpg

it's place in the trigger mechanism:

valve_knocker.png

 

impact plate:

impact_plate.png

Edited by Tjolbi

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This is not the case, the Power Pack replaces the striker plate with the plungers, the valve knocker is the part in the trigger group that hits the striker plate or plunger, releasing the gas.

I think you've got the two confused Brainplay.

 

You are correct. And this is the second time I got it confused. This is what I get for posting at 1am. :a-embarassed:

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Go for the G&G power pack, the King Arms magazine set still uses the old system of a striker plate, the G&G plunger is better. As for your barrel, the hop up type is vsr10, the profile is standard/no bull barrel and you won't need any porting. I'm not sure what the stock OD of a vsr10 barrel is, but if you ask for a stock OD non bull barrel, Ed will know how large it should be.

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I see, King Arms has a plunger set as well now. If you're only going to convert one magazine, I'd stick to the King Arms set, getting a steel knocker arm probably isn't worth the extra 30 dollars. But if you're converting two mags, get the G&G Power Pack, price wise it'll be the same as two King Arms sets but you'll have extra parts you can actually use, instead of an extra striker spring that you can't.

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I see, King Arms has a plunger set as well now. If you're only going to convert one magazine, I'd stick to the King Arms set, getting a steel knocker arm probably isn't worth the extra 30 dollars. But if you're converting two mags, get the G&G Power Pack, price wise it'll be the same as two King Arms sets but you'll have extra parts you can actually use, instead of an extra striker spring that you can't.

 

If you have the money get the Knock Arm from G&G!

My original Tanaka Knock Arm got worn down after about 800 shots with HPA and G&G Striker Spring and Power Pack installed! Then the only thing you could here when firing was the "Click" of the steel Cocking Piece (also from G&G) sliding over the worn down Tanaka Knock Arm :a-confused:

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why are all you guys saying porting is a bad hing? from edgi its only five bucks more... theretically the porting of the barrels would but less resistance on the bb when it is exiting because of more places for air to escape correct? so it sounds like its more of a hinder than a help... why?

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why are all you guys saying porting is a bad hing? from edgi its only five bucks more... theretically the porting of the barrels would but less resistance on the bb when it is exiting because of more places for air to escape correct? so it sounds like its more of a hinder than a help... why?

 

 

While porting is generally a good thing, it only works if the air/gas can actually escape through those holes. With the G&G heavy barrel, there is no space between the outer and the inner barrel, so the holes are blocked and become useless. :a-wink:

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While porting is generally a good thing, it only works if the air/gas can actually escape through those holes. With the G&G heavy barrel, there is no space between the outer and the inner barrel, so the holes are blocked and become useless. :a-wink:

 

So I just found out the Creation chamber is sodl out, so are you sure the HUb that comes with the G&G barrel will work just as good, and will work witht he VSR conversion kit?

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The hub that comes with the G&G barrel was made specifically to work with the outer barrel so the fit should be great. The inside of any of the aftermarket hubs are all the same though, so yes the G&G hub will work with the vsr conversion kit.

 

I've never had anyone CNC parts for me, but first of all, you'll need the exact dimensions of the hub, for which you'll either need the blueprints/cad file/... or the part itself. Secondly, it'll cost you quite a bit of money and seeing as the G&G hub is metal already (not sure what kind though), I really doubt you'll need it.

 

If you really want a CNC'd hub though, I suggest you go look for a local CNC shop and show them the part (the new G&G one, not the old one), as I doubt you'll be able to get your hands on a cad file or similar. You could send it by post to a CNC shop further away, but then you'll probably commit to them making a new part without having an exact quote. Which they won't be able to give you if they don't have the exact dimensions.

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The hub that comes with the G&G barrel was made specifically to work with the outer barrel so the fit should be great. The inside of any of the aftermarket hubs are all the same though, so yes the G&G hub will work with the vsr conversion kit.

 

I've never had anyone CNC parts for me, but first of all, you'll need the exact dimensions of the hub, for which you'll either need the blueprints/cad file/... or the part itself. Secondly, it'll cost you quite a bit of money and seeing as the G&G hub is metal already (not sure what kind though), I really doubt you'll need it.

 

If you really want a CNC'd hub though, I suggest you go look for a local CNC shop and show them the part (the new G&G one, not the old one), as I doubt you'll be able to get your hands on a cad file or similar. You could send it by post to a CNC shop further away, but then you'll probably commit to them making a new part without having an exact quote. Which they won't be able to give you if they don't have the exact dimensions.

 

Hey guys, big Dave here. I have assembled ALL the goodies for a World class build up of an AICS...but.....one part eludes me. Part 91 replacement. Sigh....I don't like the look of the G&G part, especially compared to either the Creation or the Best Gun versions which BOTH look quite nice!!!

 

Where on EARTH can I find either one? Both are MIA. Seriously MIA. I have never seen a part so consistently out of stock in my life. I wonder why some places even have them listed. I swear some places may have NEVER carried some of the items they list. Am I right? I have to laugh......OMG....

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