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MikeyC

Replacement AEP Pinion Gears and Motors

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Thought I would share a relatively significant piece of work for the greater good.

 

I have spent a lot of time tinkering with my TM USP which now runs on a 11.1v LiPo at around 285fps. In the process of upgrading this pistol I managed to strip the pinion gear on the motor. For other various reasons I was also looking around for a replacement, faster motor.

 

The following information should apply to all AEP pistols and the replacement pinion gears to pistols and SMG's.

 

I became aware that TM do not sell replacement pinion gears separately, only with a full motor unit, and they are hard to come by. So, I set out looking for an aftermarket pinion gear and motor.

 

The following 10 Tooth, 64 pitch 2mm bore solder on pinion makes an excellent replacement:

ARP (American Racing Products) 6410A:

pinion.jpg

The collar does need to be ground down (with a Dremel), but this is a modification that takes but a moment. This is a stainless steel item so very durable. I have put over a 1000 rounds through my USP with this gear, and have not experienced any issues in terms of abnormal gear wear from either the pinion or the first drive gear.

The are available from e-slotcar at a few bucks and they offer excellent delivery internationally both in terms of price and speed:

Pinion Gear

 

For a replacement motor I selected the Losi Mini LST Frenzy 370 Motor:

motor.jpg

Any 370 motor should fit in an AEP, but the shaft length may need to be altered. The Losi Frenzy has a shaft length of 7mm compared to the stock TM USP motor length of 4mm. However, if using one of these motors with the above pinion gear, the shaft needs to be shortened to 5mm as the replacement pinion needs to be mounted further in to the first drive gear.

Shortening of the shaft can be done easily with a Dremel cutting disk, and then the edges of the shaft beveled with a grinding disk. Take care to measure accurately as you only get one chance. Best to cut too long and then shorten further if needed than vice versa. Note that the gearbox wires are fitted in reverse polarity to that marked on the motor, so the black wire goes to the red dot on the bottom of the motor. The resistors on the bottom of the motor need to be manipulated in order to allow the base plate of the USP to fit properly, but this is very easily done (I only mention it in passing).

Installation of this motor does considerably improve trigger response and ROF also. Again, not expensive and widely available.

 

Bear in mind that the pinion is a solder fitment and an excellent guide of how to achieve this can be found here:

Pinion Soldering

 

The only reason this complete solution will not work with an SMG is that the shaft of the motor is too short. There may very well be an alternative 370 motor with a long enough shaft, but I have not researched this.

 

This researching took me to the murky world of slotcar racing and does demonstrate that there is considerable parts commonality in terms of AEP's and Slotcar / Radio Controlled models. I hope this considerable research is of some help given the difficulty in sourcing spare AEP parts.

 

Similarly, if I can be of help in the installation of the above replacement parts, please don't hesitate to post a reply or PM me.

 

Would respectfully suggest pinning this post.

Edited by airsofthawaii

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I agree, good find. A question though, you said you had an 11.1v in your USP, do you have a mosfet in there with it?

 

What is the rate of fire with the 11.1v and the new motor, do you know what the rate of fire was with the old motor?

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I agree, good find. A question though, you said you had an 11.1v in your USP, do you have a mosfet in there with it?

Yes I do, it is under the battery and so does not alter the external appearance of the gun. A note of caution though - it does not like being wet! I was playing this weekend and admitedly the rain was torrential. I was chatting with a friend when it suddenly went in to full auto in its holster and emptied its mag in to my leg! Unlike an AEG the safety does not disengage the contact terminals, so there is a risk of this happening. So, either waterproofing the gaps with tape or keeping it under a jacket if using in extremely wet conditions would be my recommendation.

 

What is the rate of fire with the 11.1v and the new motor, do you know what the rate of fire was with the old motor?

I couldn't tell you in terms of rounds per second other than to say it is blisteringly fast. It empties the mag in a couple of seconds and the trigger response is near instantaneous. In fact, I don't charge the battery to its full capacity of 12.4 volts as I think it's actually too quick. I charge it to around 11.5v and that seems optimal with this set up. I have another USP with the stock motor on 11.1v and there is a slight but noticable drop in speed on this unit compared to the one with the Losi motor at the same volatge (although both are very fast).

RichardY was the first person I know to put an 11.1v in his USP. I believe he doesn't run a MOSFET in his, and he doesn't appear to have any problems. There's a video of his 11.1v USP here:

 

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Mods - pin this?

 

At the very least I'd say this should be added to one of the existing FAQ's. I do have a couple of questions/clarifications though. I purchased two of the Frenzy's you recommended and two of the Insane's which from what I read are an upgrade to the Frenzy's. Based on your post, it sounds like all I'll need to do to use them with the stock pinion is cut down/grind the shaft, is that correct? I'll post up chrono ROF readings before and after once they come in. Also you said the shafts are too short for the SMG's, but can you guess how much too short they are?

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I purchased two of the Frenzy's you recommended and two of the Insane's which from what I read are an upgrade to the Frenzy's. Based on your post, it sounds like all I'll need to do to use them with the stock pinion is cut down/grind the shaft, is that correct?

Yes, that's right. Cut the shaft to 4mm (same as the TM stock motor length), bevel the edges and press fit the stock pinion on to the new shaft using a vice. Getting the stock pinion off the old motor is a delicate process - let me know if you want some advice on this.

 

Also you said the shafts are too short for the SMG's, but can you guess how much too short they are?

No, no idea unfortunately as I don't have an SMG to compare. The shaft on the Losi Frenzy is 7mm in length, so if you know how long the stock TM SMG motor shaft is on the SMG you could work it out from that.

 

Good Luck!

 

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Yes, that's right. Cut the shaft to 4mm (same as the TM stock motor length), bevel the edges and press fit the stock pinion on to the new shaft using a vice. Getting the stock pinion off the old motor is a delicate process - let me know if you want some advice on this.

 

 

No, no idea unfortunately as I don't have an SMG to compare. The shaft on the Losi Frenzy is 7mm in length, so if you know how long the stock TM SMG motor shaft is on the SMG you could work it out from that.

 

Good Luck!

 

Sounds good. The motors should be here in about a week, so I should have some findings to report in a couple of weeks.

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Sounds good. The motors should be here in about a week, so I should have some findings to report in a couple of weeks.

 

Great, do post how you get on. The Insane's are quite expensive and I haven't tried them - I'll be interested to see how you get on with them.

 

Are you chasing a faster trigger repsonse/ROF or are you replacing the motors for some other reason?

The reason I ask is that I put a Losi Frenzy in my USP to make it quicker (which it did moderately) on a 7.2v LiPo. However, once I'd had a taste of an improved response I felt that the limiting factor was then the power, which was when I upgraded to an 11.1v LiPo. On balance, if I had to choose one upgrade out of the two for improved speed, I would go with the 11.1v LiPo.

Saying that, 11.1v LiPo + Losi Frenzy = Awesomeness!

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Great, do post how you get on. The Insane's are quite expensive and I haven't tried them - I'll be interested to see how you get on with them.

 

Are you chasing a faster trigger repsonse/ROF or are you replacing the motors for some other reason?

The reason I ask is that I put a Losi Frenzy in my USP to make it quicker (which it did moderately) on a 7.2v LiPo. However, once I'd had a taste of an improved response I felt that the limiting factor was then the power, which was when I upgraded to an 11.1v LiPo. On balance, if I had to choose one upgrade out of the two for improved speed, I would go with the 11.1v LiPo.

Saying that, 11.1v LiPo + Losi Frenzy = Awesomeness!

 

Primarily trigger response. All my AEP's are running 7.2v 900mah 25C LiPo's so I'm content with the ROF as is. Plus, the G18's have less room for the battery than the USP. There's no way I'm fitting an 11.1v in there, especially with the SD slide.

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I saw this when first posted, Very interesting stuff.

 

When I was into finding new parts for my G18c's I posted on an RC forum about using heli motors in the AEPs. We ended up finding that 300 series motors should have fit and would have increased performance, but I never got around to getting one and I sold my G16c.

 

If you can fix the pics I will go ahead and have this pinned.

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I saw this when first posted, Very interesting stuff.

 

When I was into finding new parts for my G18c's I posted on an RC forum about using heli motors in the AEPs. We ended up finding that 300 series motors should have fit and would have increased performance, but I never got around to getting one and I sold my G16c.

 

If you can fix the pics I will go ahead and have this pinned.

 

*crosses fingers*

 

I'm hoping to have time next week to open the Glocks back up. If so, I'll be doing both the SHS gears and the Losi motors. I've got a chrono and everything, so I'll make sure to post some hard numbers regarding performance change. Those numbers will be based off using LiPo's, but if it's a large change, I'll buy a couple more and install one in one of my spare Glocks that's still setup for the stock batteries.

 

I do have my MP7 pulled apart and unfortunately the shaft is WAY to short on the Losi motors to use in the MP7. Rough guess, I'd say the shaft is 10mm shorter on the Losi motors. Maybe more. I've got to pull the Glocks apart, but honestly the shaft length looks about right (going off memory). MikeyC, would it be possible for you to post a picture of your motors (I'll do the same) just to see if maybe we have different shaft lengths?

 

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MikeyC, would it be possible for you to post a picture of your motors (I'll do the same) just to see if maybe we have different shaft lengths?

 

I am not posting the length of my shaft on a public forum! :a-laugh:

 

But seriously though, not without tearing down one of my USP's, and even then, I don't have an unmodified motor as they have all been cut to fit my AEP's. As I said in my original post the shaft length of the Losi Frenzy in unmodified form is 7mm. You can easily measure, with a pair of calipers preferably, but a ruler by eye will do. Is this what you meant, or did you mean once you had modified it?

 

I do have my MP7 pulled apart and unfortunately the shaft is WAY to short on the Losi motors to use in the MP7. Rough guess, I'd say the shaft is 10mm shorter on the Losi motors.

 

It'd be great if you could accurately measure the shaft length on the MP7 motor then I could start looking around for a suitable replacement for SMG type gearboxes.

Edited by MikeyC

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If you can fix the pics I will go ahead and have this pinned.

 

I have lost the ability to edit my original post (presumably as it has been replied to). I have however, moved the pics to a more reliable and long term location (I.e. photobucket).

 

If you want to replace them in the original post, that would be fine.

 

 

 

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Hi,

 

I'm moving this thread back up to know if someone has found a suitable motor replacement with a long enough shaft to go into a MP7 SMG ? Otherwise, is it possible that, if I get the Losi Frenzy, I can remove the stock shaft and put the Marui motor shaft in its place ?

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Hi,

 

I'm moving this thread back up to know if someone has found a suitable motor replacement with a long enough shaft to go into a MP7 SMG ? Otherwise, is it possible that, if I get the Losi Frenzy, I can remove the stock shaft and put the Marui motor shaft in its place ?

 

I've certainly not come across one yet (although have not been looking as I don't have an MP7). Your suggestion of pulling and replacing the shaft should work in principle as both the stock TM motor and the Losi Frenzy have the same diameter shafts. You'll need a puller/drift tool etc..., but I assume as you're suggesting it, you have some experience in doing this.

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I know a thing or two about motors and removing the pinion gear is one of them. As for separating the shaft from the armature, I've not gone there yet but I don't think it's something hard to do. I'll try that when I receive the Losi and feed this topic with my results if I can do that operation with success.

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Thought I would share a relatively significant piece of work for the greater good.

 

I have spent a lot of time tinkering with my TM USP which now runs on a 11.1v LiPo at around 285fps. In the process of upgrading this pistol I managed to strip the pinion gear on the motor. For other various reasons I was also looking around for a replacement, faster motor.

 

The following information should apply to all AEP pistols and the replacement pinion gears to pistols and SMG's.

 

I became aware that TM do not sell replacement pinion gears separately, only with a full motor unit, and they are hard to come by. So, I set out looking for an aftermarket pinion gear and motor.

 

The following 10 Tooth, 64 pitch 2mm bore solder on pinion makes an excellent replacement:

ARP (American Racing Products) 6410A:

pinion.jpg

The collar does need to be ground down (with a Dremel), but this is a modification that takes but a moment. This is a stainless steel item so very durable. I have put over a 1000 rounds through my USP with this gear, and have not experienced any issues in terms of abnormal gear wear from either the pinion or the first drive gear.

The are available from e-slotcar at a few bucks and they offer excellent delivery internationally both in terms of price and speed:

Pinion Gear

 

 

 

 

For a replacement motor I selected the Losi Mini LST Frenzy 370 Motor:

motor.jpg

Any 370 motor should fit in an AEP, but the shaft length may need to be altered. The Losi Frenzy has a shaft length of 7mm compared to the stock TM USP motor length of 4mm. However, if using one of these motors with the above pinion gear, the shaft needs to be shortened to 5mm as the replacement pinion needs to be mounted further in to the first drive gear.

Shortening of the shaft can be done easily with a Dremel cutting disk, and then the edges of the shaft beveled with a grinding disk. Take care to measure accurately as you only get one chance. Best to cut too long and then shorten further if needed than vice versa. Note that the gearbox wires are fitted in reverse polarity to that marked on the motor, so the black wire goes to the red dot on the bottom of the motor. The resistors on the bottom of the motor need to be manipulated in order to allow the base plate of the USP to fit properly, but this is very easily done (I only mention it in passing).

Installation of this motor does considerably improve trigger response and ROF also. Again, not expensive and widely available.

 

Bear in mind that the pinion is a solder fitment and an excellent guide of how to achieve this can be found here:

Pinion Soldering

 

The only reason this complete solution will not work with an SMG is that the shaft of the motor is too short. There may very well be an alternative 370 motor with a long enough shaft, but I have not researched this.

 

This researching took me to the murky world of slotcar racing and does demonstrate that there is considerable parts commonality in terms of AEP's and Slotcar / Radio Controlled models. I hope this considerable research is of some help given the difficulty in sourcing spare AEP parts.

 

Similarly, if I can be of help in the installation of the above replacement parts, please don't hesitate to post a reply or PM me.

 

Would respectfully suggest pinning this post.

 

 

 

wow, your a smart person. Thanks.

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I know a thing or two about motors and removing the pinion gear is one of them. As for separating the shaft from the armature, I've not gone there yet but I don't think it's something hard to do. I'll try that when I receive the Losi and feed this topic with my results if I can do that operation with success.

 

Hi, did you have any luck doing this? I'm currently trying to find a way to replace my dead skorpion motor (same grear box as MP7), I don't have much motor experience and can't figure out for the life of me how to get the shaft out.

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Hi,

 

I haven't got to do it as of now. I've had a look at the Losi Frenzy motor though and I don't know how to disassemble it. There seems to be some tabs holding the endbell and looks like there is some unsoldering to do beforehand. I have searched for how to take it down on Google but with no success. Will post pics soon.

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Hi,

 

I haven't got to do it as of now. I've had a look at the Losi Frenzy motor though and I don't know how to disassemble it. There seems to be some tabs holding the endbell and looks like there is some unsoldering to do beforehand. I have searched for how to take it down on Google but with no success. Will post pics soon.

 

That's the same problem I was dealing with, how you're actually supposed to get in the things.

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imag0586do.jpg

 

See those brown things soldered to the can ? I don't know exactly what they're made of and not sure at all I have enough "material" to solder it back in when I reinstall everything. It's the first time I'm dealing with one of these.

 

Also you can see the 4 tabs I was talking about.

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imag0586do.jpg

 

See those brown things soldered to the can ? I don't know exactly what they're made of and not sure at all I have enough "material" to solder it back in when I reinstall everything. It's the first time I'm dealing with one of these.

 

Also you can see the 4 tabs I was talking about.

 

Is that whats on the new motor? I don't have those on my stock motor. It's sealed with that same tab method though and you can't really pry them open easily.

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See those brown things soldered to the can ? I don't know exactly what they're made of and not sure at all I have enough "material" to solder it back in when I reinstall everything. It's the first time I'm dealing with one of these.

 

Quoting myself but for those who don't know, these are capacitators. Discovered that today by typing in google "rc motor brown thing solder" or something like that :a-laugh:

 

Anyways, I think that it's easy to source if one was to damage those things while unsoldering them. I believe it's easy to unsolder them to do the shaft replacement work and solder them back in place.

 

I'll update when I can get the job done.

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Hello,

This excellent thread is somewhat old now, so, I thought it's worth checking in to get some opinions before I purchase a replacement motor (or two) for the CYMA 030 G18C AEPs I have with blown motors.

 

I would like, in this priority: 1) Reliability, 2) To not break/wear out my gearbox faster than "stock", 3) Increased Trigger Response.

 

Increased rate of fire is not something I'm trying to achieve, but, I won't go out of my way to avoid it. I mean, it is cool, but, I don't desire to dump the whole clip in the blink of an eye each time I pull the trigger :P

 

I see a lot of 370 sized motors for around ten bucks, but I don't know which ones would work well? How many "turns" should I go after? Etc.

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