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Captain_Fordo

First "Real" airsoft build

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So I'm a fairly new player to airsoft and I've only been to a playing field twice and I borrowed a friends backup M4. I'm a marksman type of person and was a decent marksman for my woodsball team I used to play in before I gave paintball a rest. I've been looking at "Sniper Rifles" on Evike, Airsplat, and Airsoft Megastore and after reading dozens of threads that I'd be investing $200 extra ontop of the $90-$150 base for a better build, but still would be pretty useless against someone using a AEG. I'm looking into building a DMR instead because it seems other more knowledgable players suggest them over bolt action rifles. Is there a good receiver and stock and outer barrel I should invest in? I'm looking at a gun for basic marksman roles, small skirmishes with friends and occasional plinking. I'd like to go off a M4 with a durable plastic body but preferably a metal body and a longer than usual barrel. Is my budget too low or is my build possible?

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A DMR is the most expensive thing in airsoft. First off all this is a good post

http://www.airsoftsniperforum.com/43-longr...ur-dmr-aeg.html

 

Second you can't just replace all internals and call it a dmr. You will need to do a lot of mods yourself as those who are above

 

Third if you still would like to do a dmr. Don't start to immediately replace parts when you get it , play a little with it and find out you don't like in it

 

longer than usual barrel

 

Ohh and longer barrel doesn't = accuracy and range

 

Basic physics of airsoft. I ought you to read this too

http://www.airsoft2day.com/news/26-the-bas...of-airsoft.html

Edited by Tom500

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A DMR is the most expensive thing in airsoft. First off all this is a good post

http://www.airsoftsniperforum.com/43-longr...ur-dmr-aeg.html

 

Second you can't just replace all internals and call it a dmr. You will need to do a lot of mods yourself as those who are above

 

Third if you still would like to do a dmr. Don't start to immediately replace parts when you get it , play a little with it and find out you don't like in it

 

 

 

Ohh and longer barrel doesn't = accuracy and range

 

Basic physics of airsoft. I ought you to read this too

http://www.airsoft2day.com/news/26-the-bas...of-airsoft.html

 

DMR is not the most expensive btw. Any high end bolt action will cost $1,000+ just for the internals and more.

 

DMR will cost around $200-300 to replace ALL the internals. Suggesting if you even use Riot SC gears, the built for any DMR or aeg is rather cheap compared to any bolt action. DMR cost more than "AEG" is because of the external. People like their dmr to look "cool"

 

$200 ontop of a base of $100-150 for a sniper rifle will get you no where. Period. You budget is too low if you want to outrange an aeg and any aeg that has the budget of $350 will shoot at least 20-25 rps at 400 fps with 150-200 feet.

 

Now that you want a DMR, I suggest you playing a bit more games with your friend's gun and seeing what you really want to be.

 

Onto your built.

EXTERNAL DOES NOT MATTER!!! Period. I can use a :censored2: jg or G&G external and perform as well as any G&P DMR... Internal is what matters. It is just how much durability you want for your gun(metal receiver) and how good looking you want your gun.

 

Example of what I mean if you don't understand.

I can buy a Ferrarri for 1 million dollars. I can buy a toyota supra for $30,000-50,000. Upgrade that supra with $300,000 of stuff and the toyota supra will be faster than the ferrarri. I spent half the cost of the ferrarri for the same or better performance.

 

Looking at your budget, it seems like you don't have much.

IMO, go with the G&G combat raider (m4) or the jg m4.

Both are around $100-150. Which will give you $200 to spend and that will tune your gun by a lot.

With this, you will be able to achieve a "aeg" that can shoot pretty accurate and far. But not your "dmr". Well it could be a dmr because DMR in airsoft term is 450 fps and single shot. Most field are reg at 400 fps and dmr are usually higher but only single shot.

 

However, you will not acquire the looks of a DMR.

 

 

Most people use a 455 tbb(tightbore barrel/inner barrel) because it gives the "best" grouping. imo, the 455mm makes your m4 just a bit longer. Just a regular m4 with a silencer. Doesn't have the DMR look unless you extend it with a 509mm tbb with a 8-12 inch rail and bipod and etc...

 

 

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How much are you looking to spend, without working or getting a tech to build you one, there isnt really a out of the box dmr.

I'm aware that DMR's aren't bought premade I'm looking for a good base gun to build off of over time. My current budget is $210 but it will grow over time and I would invest in parts as time progresses.

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A DMR is the most expensive thing in airsoft. First off all this is a good post

http://www.airsoftsniperforum.com/43-longr...ur-dmr-aeg.html

 

Second you can't just replace all internals and call it a dmr. You will need to do a lot of mods yourself as those who are above

 

Third if you still would like to do a dmr. Don't start to immediately replace parts when you get it , play a little with it and find out you don't like in it

 

 

 

Ohh and longer barrel doesn't = accuracy and range

 

Basic physics of airsoft. I ought you to read this too

http://www.airsoft2day.com/news/26-the-bas...of-airsoft.html

Alright, although I don't believe that DMR's are the most expensive, I can say that it is cheaper to make than upgrading a vsr10/l96 base to a long range gun that out ranges a good AEG. My only issue is that my field allows 400fps. Will this present an issue? The field requires their ammo and no outside ammo from what I remember.

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. My only issue is that my field allows 400fps. Will this present an issue?

 

First off all fps is overrated. If fps had such a big impact on performance , high end brands would put 400fps springs in their guns for example look at Tokyo Marui their guns fps is somewhere 295 fps and still it shots much further and precise then those 400+fps guns. You should concentrate more on the accuracy and range.

 

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First off all fps is overrated.

 

It's overrated simply because you don't know how to handle it properly........

 

If fps had such a big impact on performance , high end brands would put 400fps springs in their guns for example look at Tokyo Marui their guns fps is somewhere 295 fps

 

Oh really? If TM shoots 400FPS in stock form, then it'd be out of business faster than you can blink your eyes.

It's called LAW. Japan is limited to 1J.

 

 

and still it shots much further and precise then those 400+fps guns. You should concentrate more on the accuracy and range.

I've seen stock "400FPS" guns easily out range TMs, right out of the box.

 

 

 

Thing is....you don't know a thing about hop and energy.....

"FPS" or "kinetic energy" is what "powers" the rounds.

Guess what? There's something called air which generates resistance which FORCES the rounds to lose energy.

 

The more energy that the round has, the longer amount of time that it'll move (ignoring gravity)

Which means, with more energy, your "potential" effective range will be higher.

 

Potential because you need to have non-:pain: hop/barrel and use nice BBs.

If not then it's going to suck like those "400FPS" guns that you've seen.

 

 

I'd love to see a stock TM to hit something accurately from 300+ feet away.

 

 

 

 

 

 

_______________________________________________________________

Back to Topic

 

$200? Budget? Who the hell cares about budget if you are doing a "REAL" build and not a "budget" build.

 

Gearbox, well, depends on

 

Prometheus 6.03 + ER-hop OR Madbull 6.03 + ER-hop + LRB

"455" is where hop "max out", however with a longer barrel you can have "FPS creep" and you "might" need a longer barrel to stabilize the rounds. (higher consistency)

And if you are going to use longer barrel, might as well just switch to an SR-25 with V2.5 gearbox.

 

High speed ratio gears 10.44:1 ~ 13:1

 

Some nice torque motor, personally loves the JG M42

 

MOSFET, could use a basic FET or use a computerized one with Pre-cocking, keep it in mind tho that Pre-cocking will put A LOT of stress on the piston.

 

rest are pretty straight forward

 

 

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It's overrated simply because you don't know how to handle it properly........

 

http://www.airsoftretreat.com/forums/index.php?topic=36387.0

 

http://mackila.com/airsoft/atp/04-a-01.htm ( look at the table below )

 

The first one exaplains why and the second shows the statistic in second link there is a table and it shows fps and the effective range , the difference isn't that big.

Google it and you can see a lot of topics on this. Your gain in range is somewhere 15-20feet

 

FYI. A close friend of mine has an air gun which shots 1000fps(300m/s) and hes range is 147feet. Air guns fps is a lot more than airsoft but their range is lacking.

There is more things to worry about than fps

 

Oh really? If TM shoots 400FPS in stock form, then it'd be out of business faster than you can blink your eyes.

It's called LAW. Japan is limited to 1J.

 

What if I told you I needed something to compare and I know that japans law is 1J

 

Potential because you need to have non-:pain: hop/barrel and use nice BBs.

If not then it's going to suck like those "400FPS" guns that you've seen.

 

Well thats not fair. I was talking about only fps and you add a barrel , hop up and nice bbs. I think you didn't understand me correctly. I was meaning that ALONE fps is useless.

 

I'd love to see a stock TM to hit something accurately from 300+ feet away.

 

I'd love to see an real steel ak-47 hit a penny from about 3000+feet or a LMG shoot accurately

I read your post the same as I wotten my examples. I can say that to any stock aeg from any brand

Out of the box TM has a good range an accuracy but no one can beat your standarts

 

I've seen stock "400FPS" guns easily out range TMs, right out of the box.

 

Like all forums I saw that and I saw that. But I don't believe this , a stock TM versus a stock (insert brand name here ) goy better results

But the word I 'saw' you saw the performance only you didn't see if there was anything changed or not. I can take a acm aeg change all the parts in it go on my local field and boost on how much my stock acm is better than your (again insert brand here )

 

Thing is....you don't know a thing about hop and energy.....

"FPS" or "kinetic energy" is what "powers" the rounds.

Guess what? There's something called air which generates resistance which FORCES the rounds to lose energy.

The more energy that the round has, the longer amount of time that it'll move (ignoring gravity)

Which means, with more energy, your "potential" effective range will be higher.

 

And a longer barrel means more range and accuracy. Your using physics and logic. Let me use logic too , a longer barrel should mean better range and accuracy but for some reason anything more than 509mm is harming your range and accuracy. A tighter barrel 6.01 doesn't mean its better than a 6.03 ( tighter isn't better ) even some 6.04 are better and now the same applies to FPS.

Edited by Tom500

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...aaaaaanywho with your current budget and plans to slowly accrue parts as your budget increases, I suggest getting a decent bodied m4 rated at ~400 fps and a 6.03 prometheus barrel with an R-hop. If you are really on a budget and would like to spend some more money on something else get a madbull 6.03. Take your time installing the R-hop on the promy barrel, and in the meantime play with your stock m4 so you can get a baseline of the performance of your AEG. As your budget grows then start to slowly add parts to your gun. Do all the airseal upgrades/mods after your hop-up/barrel upgrade. After that you can upgrade parts for the durability aspect of DMRS as parts break/your budget grows.

 

Just wanted to mention that the hop-up upgrade will probably give you the most noticeable accuracy/range upgrade, followed by barrel(?)

 

That's how I'd do it anyway, read the guides that were posted in this thread for more details on the durability upgrades and mods

 

This JG seems good for a start

Don't know about AGM, but this fits the bill nicely, note that the inner barrel is 509 mm, as opposed to what we recommend 455 mm, might make the barrel (slightly) more expensive to buy when upgrading

 

I actually wouldn't worry too much about the stock FPS rating, once you start upgrading, you can always just get a stronger spring for ~$10

Edited by Vikeif

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http://www.airsoftretreat.com/forums/index.php?topic=36387.0

 

http://mackila.com/airsoft/atp/04-a-01.htm ( look at the table below )

 

The first one exaplains why and the second shows the statistic in second link there is a table and it shows fps and the effective range , the difference isn't that big.

Google it and you can see a lot of topics on this. Your gain in range is somewhere 15-20feet

 

FYI. A close friend of mine has an air gun which shots 1000fps(300m/s) and hes range is 147feet. Air guns fps is a lot more than airsoft but their range is lacking.

There is more things to worry about than fps

 

I don't even need to bother clicking the link.

Also I know for fact that the info from ATP supports my side and not yours....

 

Google it? Funny, I have guns that have 300+ feet effective range.

 

Air Gun doesn't even use hop.....

 

What if I told you I needed something to compare and I know that japans law is 1J

You are not making sense......

 

 

 

Well thats not fair. I was talking about only fps and you add a barrel , hop up and nice bbs. I think you didn't understand me correctly. I was meaning that ALONE fps is useless.

 

Hello? It's called "control".

You use the same barrel, hop-up and BBs and only compare the performance of different FPS.

TM has good range even at low FPS only because their barrel and hop are good.

 

Learn the proper way to do experiment.

 

How is not fair to have everything the same except FPS?

Isn't that what we are comparing anyway?

 

Lame logic.

 

 

 

I'd love to see an real steel ak-47 hit a penny from about 3000+feet or a LMG shoot accurately

I read your post the same as I wotten my examples. I can say that to any stock aeg from any brand

Out of the box TM has a good range an accuracy but no one can beat your standarts

Um....real steel has nothing to do with this....

So your point is invalid....

 

 

 

 

Like all forums I saw that and I saw that. But I don't believe this , a stock TM versus a stock (insert brand name here ) goy better results

But the word I 'saw' you saw the performance only you didn't see if there was anything changed or not. I can take a acm aeg change all the parts in it go on my local field and boost on how much my stock acm is better than your (again insert brand here )

 

What the hell are you talking about.....?

You are telling me that I don't know if anything is changed or not when I'm the one who picked up the gun brand new from Airsoft GI and pulled it out of the box.....?

 

And funny, you believed in those "FPS" posts doesn't matter which are on forum yet you don't believe those posts about stock guns out ranging TM....

 

 

And a longer barrel means more range and accuracy. Your using physics and logic. Let me use logic too , a longer barrel should mean better range and accuracy but for some reason anything more than 509mm is harming your range and accuracy. A tighter barrel 6.01 doesn't mean its better than a 6.03 ( tighter isn't better ) even some 6.04 are better and now the same applies to FPS.

Um....yep...you have no idea what you are talking about....

People have horrible range with 509mm and above compared to shorter barrel because they don't have enough air volume....

 

 

 

 

Forgot to mention, you don't even know how to identify a TM and you are saying how amazing it is and it out shoots every other stock guns? lol

Edited by EDI 1st

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Every time I think of posting on forums. I get a reminder on why I should not do this. Congratulations EDI 1st you won a an internet arguement. I could argue more but I think there is no real reason , you will pile a ton of crap on me anyway. I am pretty sure you haven't read twice what I wrote but who cares. Pick up a can of soda and be happy on ruining a persons day. All I just wanted to do is to share what I have read on the forums to beginners . I like to read , maybe everything isn't correct but still I wanted to be helpful but now I'll be just a bookworm and won't post anything because some people like the one above can't explain something without putting others down.

 

P.S sorry for screwing up the thread

Edited by Tom500

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Every time I think of posting on forums. I get a reminder on why I should not do this. Congratulations EDI 1st you won a an internet arguement. I could argue more but I think there is no real reason , you will pile a ton of crap on me anyway. I am pretty sure you haven't read twice what I wrote but who cares. Pick up a can of soda and be happy on ruining a persons day. All I just wanted to do is to share what I have read on the forums to beginners . I like to read , maybe everything isn't correct but still I wanted to be helpful but now I'll be just a bookworm and won't post anything because some people like the one above can't explain something without putting others down.

 

P.S sorry for screwing up the thread

 

Um no, it's a reminder of how ignorant you are.

 

If FPS doesn't matter, than can you explain why my 550FPS 2011 Summer build-off SR-25 can hit targets 300ft away accurately while with the exact same barrel/hop setup my 280FPS TM can't?

 

I haven't read twice? Sorry, I probably have being building and teching on airsoft guns longer than you've played airsoft.

 

Putting others down eh?

I only do that when they pretend to know what they are talking about when they don't.

 

You want to be helpful?

Then go learn what's correct and what's not.

Giving incorrect info isn't exactly "being helpful".

 

 

 

Oh, and, IIRC that thread on Airsoft Retreat did mention that the rounds will fly further with higher FPS.

I'll actually click the link and get some quotes just for you.

 

Oh here, reply #4 and original post

http://www.airsoftretreat.com/forums/index....html#msg400418

Edited by EDI 1st

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EDI CAN I DRINK THE SODA TO A RUINED DAY IT'S FUN AND I'M THIRSTY AND YOU HAVEN'T YET! :a-laugh:

 

 

ONNNNNN TOPIC the AGM Vikeif linked is okay, it shoots like 415 FPS out of the box if I'm correct. The metal on them is a bit brittle though and can crack easy. I saw a guy just the other day who used the same AGM as a DMR. The gun was nice but he was a douche.

 

I'd just go with a JG, they're better quality than the AGM all around even if you're upgrading the gearbox anyway.

 

Plus the JG says BAMF. If you own the gun you are automatically a badass motherf*cker.

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EDI CAN I DRINK THE SODA TO A RUINED DAY IT'S FUN AND I'M THIRSTY AND YOU HAVEN'T YET! :a-laugh:

 

 

ONNNNNN TOPIC the AGM Vikeif linked is okay, it shoots like 415 FPS out of the box if I'm correct. The metal on them is a bit brittle though and can crack easy. I saw a guy just the other day who used the same AGM as a DMR. The gun was nice but he was a douche.

 

I'd just go with a JG, they're better quality than the AGM all around even if you're upgrading the gearbox anyway.

 

Plus the JG says BAMF. If you own the gun you are automatically a badass motherf*cker.

 

 

Let's go grab some soda together :a-wink:

 

JG has one of the best stock gearbox in the market, and yes, better than Tokyo Marui (oh boy)

The only thing that it needs is some tuning.

 

Or go grab an Army L85, elongated cylinder <3

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Oh gee, multiple sodas. Everybody wins.

 

Well, except for the guy you schooled(literally).

 

 

 

Is the Army L85 even any good? The only one I've shot was a buddy's ICS. I've seen them but never paid attention.

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The FPS argument is more to do with respect to BB weights than actual FPS. It's not really the FPS that's important, it's the energy output which we measure in FPS with 0.2 g BBs as a standard. So a 350 FPS .25g bb will have greater range and accuracy than a 400 FPS 0.2g bb because it has both more energy and it's greater mass makes air resistance less of a contributing factor. So a 550 FPS sr-25 can hit a target 300 ft away because it obviously has much higher energy than the 280 FPS TM, assuming you are using the same BBs in both. Also not accounting for any miscellaneous internal issues.

 

Which isn't to say that the 280 FPS TM can't hit something at 300'; with max hop and if aimed like a mortar it might be able do it :a-laugh:

 

 

EDIT: derp replied too late, oh well here's some info

Edited by Vikeif

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Oh gee, multiple sodas. Everybody wins.

 

Well, except for the guy you schooled(literally).

 

 

 

Is the Army L85 even any good? The only one I've shot was a buddy's ICS. I've seen them but never paid attention.

 

12 pack, at my place now :P

 

 

G&G L85 clone

So GB is a tank lol

 

 

The FPS argument is more to do with respect to BB weights than actual FPS. It's not really the FPS that's important, it's the energy output which we measure in FPS with 0.2 g BBs as a standard. So a 350 FPS .25g bb will have greater range and accuracy than a 400 FPS 0.2g bb because it has both more energy and it's greater mass makes air resistance less of a contributing factor. So a 550 FPS sr-25 can hit a target 300 ft away because it obviously has much higher energy than the 280 FPS TM, assuming you are using the same BBs in both. Also not accounting for any miscellaneous internal issues.

 

Which isn't to say that the 280 FPS TM can't hit something at 300'; with max hop and if aimed like a mortar it might be able do it :a-laugh:

 

 

EDIT: derp replied too late, oh well here's some info

 

Yep, and for a while I tried to convert people to use "energy" instead of FPS, gave up on that for obvious and various reasons.

People need to understand basic physics....

Edited by EDI 1st

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I'd be there but you're kind of on the other side of the country. :a-laugh:

 

 

Coolio about the Army though, might get one to screw around with. I find the L85 uncomfortable but if it actually works I have found the most unique loaner gun around.

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