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Tanaka M700 Aics Fps Limiter?

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Hi Guys,

 

Lately I have been reading a lot of reviews in the hopes of buying a sniper rifle in the near future. Well the M700 looked very appealing to me, its gorgeous, and from almost every review/post I read everyone claimed it can shoot 500-600 fps stock with .2g bbs running on green or red gas. That was the most appealing feature, pay more, but get a rifle that needs very few if any upgrades. Well I go in today to my local airsoft supplier, Airsoft Extreme in Torrance, to test it out. Everything was going to plan until I found out that there is a new Law in Japan that limists the FPS on guns, so this rifle that I was shooting was clocking it at 300-360 fps with .2g bbs and green gas.

 

I was so dissapointed, here I am expecting to shoot 500 fps and I am looking at something that clocks in slower than my AK, which makes this thing almost pointless. The question is, is anyone aware of this? Has anyone bought the latest model that has this limiter? Is it still effective? Is there a way to remove the limiter? Any answers would be greatly appreciated, and if all else fails with this model what suggestions do you have for an alternate rifle, I am looking at something that can shoot around 500 with .2s.

 

Thanks

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how about you ask the question without all the stupid backstory?

 

thats what the gun crono's at on duster with the PCS turned up.

 

Thanks for being rude, the reason for the back story is to give you all the important information pertaining to the question so I can get a concise answer.

 

I do appreciate the reply, but I am having a hard time understanding it, are you telling me that I was shooting the rifle with the PCS turned up? and whats a duster?

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Thanks for being rude, the reason for the back story is to give you all the important information pertaining to the question so I can get a concise answer.

 

hey any time

I'm still failing to see what a law in japan has to do with you, unless you live in japan.

 

I do appreciate the reply, but I am having a hard time understanding it, are you telling me that I was shooting the rifle with the PCS turned up? and whats a duster?

 

great questions, exactly why you shouldnt own a 500fps rifle, start out with something with less of a chance of wounding someone.

 

duster gas is lower pressure than green gas, as green gas is illegal to own in japan, thats what they use.

PCS is the "FPS limiter" built into tanaka guns

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hey any time

I'm still failing to see what a law in japan has to do with you, unless you live in japan.

great questions, exactly why you shouldnt own a 500fps rifle, start out with something with less of a chance of wounding someone.

 

duster gas is lower pressure than green gas, as green gas is illegal to own in japan, thats what they use.

PCS is the "FPS limiter" built into tanaka guns

 

I think I am starting to get it.

 

I do not live in Japan, but according to the guy who was showing me the rifle at the shop the law applies to guns being exported as well, maybe he was wrong, I really hope so. I doubt they would demo a rifle with the pcs turned up, but Ill try to turn it all the way off next time I am in there.

 

I currently own 3 guns, 2 CAs and a TM all assault rifles, so instead of getting another one I want to try my hand in something different, but I want to be sure I am getting something that wont be inferior to the 3 AEGs I already own.

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it either has the pcs turned all the way on, or it is partially broken (hopup torn likely) and he's bullshitting you.

 

You have given me new hope for this rifle, thanks. So I assume no one has heard anything about the newest Tanaka shippments being outfitted with some sort of limiter, other than the PCS?

 

Has anyone gotten a new one in the last month or two? Any issues?

Edited by BrainExploder

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I actually heard of something similar to what you're experiencing right now, that there's supposedly this new law in Japan limiting the power of all airsoft rifles to approximately 1 joule, or 330 FPS on .20 pellets. Don't worry, your rifle can still be tuned for more power. It's not like as if you can't buy new parts, yes?

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Guest CaptainPlastic
how about you ask the question without all the stupid backstory?

 

Me again!

 

I'm still a bit confused TDS. Why was his back-story stupid? I thought it was quite informative. :a-grin:

 

The new Japanese law limits all airsoft weapon to 0.98 joules when using 134a and .02g BBs in temperatures between 20 and 35 degrees centigrade.

 

It applies to all companies who make airsoft weapons in Japan, including those that export their weapons. It applies to Tanaka.

 

Duster gas isn't used in Japan (sorry TDS). Green Gas was used in some weapons but it is no longer available thanks to the new law.

 

:a-salute:

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Duster Gas = HFC 134a

 

Baring an actual limiting part being added to the works, I would presume they just turned the PCS dow to lower the pressure. Should that be the case you would only need to open it back up and run Green gas to jump your FPS significantly.

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Guest CaptainPlastic
Duster Gas = HFC 134a

 

Baring an actual limiting part being added to the works, I would presume they just turned the PCS dow to lower the pressure. Should that be the case you would only need to open it back up and run Green gas to jump your FPS significantly.

 

Duster gas means the contents of a can of gas intended to blow the dust off something, right? I hardly think that such a product would include the type of lubricants needed for an airsoft product. Who wants lubricant all over their new camera or keyboard? In Japan we use airsoft 134a, not duster gas. It may be the same basic gas but it’s not the same product.

 

I would imagine that Tanaka have put something fairly substantial into their system to stop the easy increase of power in their guns, but to explain my opinion I’ll have to give you a bit more back-story.

 

A high ranking Japanese police official has stated that, in his opinion, simply owning the parts to convert an airsoft weapon into an illegal airsoft weapon implies the intent to do so, and therefore the intent to commit a crime. This is why I’m sending my power parts back to England in the hopes that one day this law may be lifted, or at least eased.

 

To follow this train of logic, if Tanaka fitted their rifles with an easy to use valve that allowed their rifles to be taken over the legal power level, they would be guilty of the intent to provide illegal weapons.

 

I’m sure that Tanaka rifles will be able to be customized for more power, but you can bet that Tanaka won’t make it as easy as turning a valve to do so.

 

:a-salute:

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Well that new information certainly complicates things. Its hard justifying buying a 500 dollar rifle that wont be able to put out even 400 fps. Sounds like this law is new and few have experienced its effects most likely due to the fact that TMs are in the law standards and this law does not apply to them.

 

Thanks for the info guys, I am going to have to look around for possible other options, all of the sudden the Maruzen Type 96 and the Dragunov sound like better alternatives.

 

The guy at the store did tell me that they are trying to get this limiter lifted, but no success yet.

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Well that new information certainly complicates things. Its hard justifying buying a 500 dollar rifle that wont be able to put out even 400 fps. Sounds like this law is new and few have experienced its effects most likely due to the fact that TMs are in the law standards and this law does not apply to them.

 

Thanks for the info guys, I am going to have to look around for possible other options, all of the sudden the Maruzen Type 96 and the Dragunov sound like better alternatives.

 

The guy at the store did tell me that they are trying to get this limiter lifted, but no success yet.

The gas used is a big factor, Tanaka rifles put out a lot more than 440 FPS. With Red gas (ET-1600 not a cheap knock off) Tanakas have been known to pierce the 600 mark.

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Guest CaptainPlastic
The guy at the store did tell me that they are trying to get this limiter lifted, but no success yet.

 

The law only came into affect in late August 2006 and I'm sure that if the crimes that caused this law to be drafted in the first place are not committed again, the law will be deemed a success and kept on the books.

 

It was drafted to bring down companies like Digicon and has been very successful in doing that.

 

:a-salute:

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Guest CaptainPlastic
Assuming this law does stick, will replacing the bolt return a new Tanaka rifle to it's former glory?

 

It's a law, and if laws work, they stick. If they don't work, new laws are created, and if there continue to be airsoft crimes in Japan we could see a ban.

 

As for replacing the bolt....no idea.

 

Why not PM TDS?

 

:a-salute:

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Well today I went back to the shop and I couldnt resist the appeal of the AICS M700 so I got it eventhough its shooting at around 360, looks like the law is here and it is working. The guy told me they are trying to get the issue resolved and so far it looks like the limiter is in the bolt and the trigger, but he also tells me that the g&p power bolt can give a 100 fps boost.

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Guest CaptainPlastic
Well today I went back to the shop and I couldnt resist the appeal of the AICS M700 so I got it...

 

Just out of interest, did you get the green one or the black one?

 

:a-confused:

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Just out of interest, did you get the green one or the black one?

 

:a-confused:

 

I got the green one :) its such a heavy duty rifle, it feels like it can fall off a building and then go back to shooting, the guy at the store told me no one has ever broght one back due to damage.

 

Does anyone have any experience with the g&g power bolt?

 

P.S. I did the poor man's chrono and the rifle was able to penatrate the bottom center of an actual coke can which supposedly puts it at 385+ fps.

Edited by BrainExploder

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I got my gun in late July from a US retailer...would this mean that my gun would be limited?

 

I think the only way to tell is to chrono it, maybe do the poor man's chrono, if you can shoot through the top of the can with .2 bbs you probably have the unlimited version, but if not then chances are you got one from the new batch.

 

http://www.airsoftretreat.com/reviews/show....php?product=71

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I don't know, but I would buy the G&G power bolt and see what happens.

 

I still call :pain:, you don't need anything.

 

This is the first ive heard, of a gun that isnt even assembled in japan, being reduced in power before being shipped to another country (read: not japan), it just doesnt make sense, if it was actually happening I think I would have heard of it somewhere besides one retailer with one gun, unless it was a "used" gun. IMHO its a retailer trying to get a newbie to choke down some aftermarket parts he doesnt need.

 

check the PCS, check the hop bucking, and if worse comes to worse, replace the hammer spring for a whopping 11 bucks, those are pretty much the only three things that will reduce your power any substancial amount. you don't need a $100 power bolt, you don't need a tightbore, you don't need any other upgrades.

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Its not shooting over 400 thats for certain, I have tried the PCS in every direction and according to the chrono at the store and the poor man's chrono its just around 400, no where near the 500-600 I was reading in reviews. Those guys wouldnt fool with me like that, its AEX a respectable store in the US, and I have bought 3 guns from them before so I don't think they would risk screwing me at the expense of loosing my business all together.

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Have you done a real crono?

 

the poor mans crono is infailable!

 

nevermind eyeballing the firing of a round projectile at a round surface and expecting consistant results! its flawless!

 

when you get actual numbers, THEN :censored2: about power....

 

Those guys wouldnt fool with me like that, its AEX a respectable store in the US, and I have bought 3 guns from them before so I don't think they would risk screwing me at the expense of loosing my business all together.

 

Yeah if they were such stand up guys, they would have had the gun performing at what the gun should perform stock, before selling it, and they wouldnt be trying to force feed you high cost parts you don't need to get it back up to that level.

Edited by TDS

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okay, so say you have the bolt with the bottom side up, and the handle facing away from you. If you were to go eye level with the bolt, (eyes level with the end that does not have the handle) and skrewed the PCS knob counter clockwise, that will open the bolt...open it half way, then turn it a bit more...shoot...open a bit more...shoot...etc until you see the power drop that means you have gone too far. don't FORGET TO PUT THE SCREW SET BACK IN!!!

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